21/04/2017 at 10:11 #60945
Thanks to the 15mm Conan threads, I was wondering what 15mm minatures are on the market that would be suitable for the denizens of Robert E. Howard’s Conan world?
I “borrowed” the following list from a wiki site, thus the extra comments next to each race mentioned to help out, but of course descritions from the actual novels would be a better way to go when suggesting miniatures.
Kingdom, Region, or Ethnic Group Possible Analogue(s) Acheron A fallen kingdom corresponding to the Roman Empire. Its territory covered Aquilonia, Nemedia, and Argos. In Greek mythology, Acheron was one of the four rivers of Hades (cf. “Stygia”). Afghulistan Afghanistan. Afghulistan (sometimes “Ghulistan”) is the common name of the habitat of different tribes in the Himelian Mountains. The name itself is a mixture of the historical names of Gulistan and Afghanistan. Alkmeenon Delphi. Its name derives from the Alcmaeonidae, who funded the construction the Temple of Apollo in Delphi, from which the oracle operated. Amazon Mentioned in Robert E. Howard’s <i>Hyborian Age</i> essay, the kingdom of the Amazons refers to various legends of Greek Amazons, or more specifically to the Dahomey Amazons. In classical legend, Amazonia was a nation of warrior women in Asia Minor and North Africa. The legend may be based upon the Sarmatians, a nomadic Iranian tribe of the Kuban, whose women were required to slay an enemy before they might marry. Aquilonia A cross between the Roman Empire and Carolingian Empire. The name is borrowed from Aquilonia, a city of Southern Italy, between modern Venosa and Benevento; it is also an ancient name of Quimper and resembles that of Aquitaine, a French region ruled by England for a long portion of the Middle Ages. The name is derived from Latin <i>aquilo(n–)</i>, “north wind”. Argos Various seafaring traders of the Mediterranean. The name comes from the <i>Argo</i>, ship of the Argonauts; or perhaps from the city of Argos, Peloponnesos, reputedly the oldest city in Greece, situated at the head of the Gulf of Argolis near modern Nafplion. Also, hints of Italy in regards to the indigenous population’s appearance, names and culture. Howard labels the populace of his Argos as “Argosseans”, whereas the folk of the historical Argos are known as “Argives”. In Hyborian Age cartography, Argos takes on the shape of a “shoe” in its border boundaries as compared to Italy appearing as a “boot”. The coastal city of Messantia/Massantia derives its name from <i>Massalia</i>, the name given to Marseilles by its Greek founders. Asgard Dark Age Scandinavia. Ásgard is the home of the Æsir in Norse mythology. Howard states that the Baltic Sea would, post cataclysm, divide his fictional Asgard into the modern Norway, Sweden and Denmark according to The Hyborian Age essay. Barachan Islands The Caribbean Islands. The pirate town of Tortage takes its name from Tortuga. Border Kingdoms Geographically located over the modern German Baltic Sea coast. A lawless place full of savages, Conan once traveled through the Border Kingdom on his way to Nemedia. He befriended Mar the Piper and the King of the Border Kingdoms. He helped save the kingdom before returning to his quest to reach Nemedia. Bossonian Marches Wales, with an overlay of colonial-era North America. Possibly from Bossiney, a former parliamentary borough in Cornwall, South West England, which included Tintagel Castle, connected with the Matter of Britain. Brythunia The continental homelands of the Angles and Saxons who invaded Great Britain, which is the origin of the name. Semantically, the name Brythunia is from the Welsh <i>Brython</i>, “Briton”, derived from the same root as the Latin <i>Brito</i>, Britannia, although Howard stated that the name was kept by the Æsir and Nemedians that settled there. The land is depicted geographically over modern Poland, Lithuania, and Latvia. Cimmeria Howard states in <i>The Hyborian Age</i> that “the Gaels, ancestors of the Irish and Highland Scots, descended from pure-blooded Cimmerian clans.” He correlates Cimmeria to the Cymric people, the Cimbri, the Gimirrai, the Cimmerians and the Crimea. Geographically located over the modern Ireland, Scotland and England, since during the cataclysm which would mark the end of the said Hyborian Age, Cimmeria is said (according to the essay “The Hyborian Age” by R.E.Howard) to partially sink, surrounded by what would be the North Sea, its mountains dislocating into the British Isles. Conajohara (Aquilonia) The name may have been based on Canajoharie. Corinthia Ancient Greece. From Corinth (Korinthos), a rich city in Classical Greece. Possibly suggested to Howard by the Epistles to the Corinthians, or by the region of Carinthia. Darfar Howard derived this name from the region of Darfur, Sudan, in north-central Africa. Darfur is an Arabic language name meaning “abode (<i>dar</i>) of the Fur“, the dominant people of the area. In changing the name to Darfar, Howard unwittingly changed the Arabic meaning to “the abode of mice”. The original Darfur is now the westernmost part of the Republic of the Sudan. Gunderland Possibly from Gunderland of Hesbaye, a count in the Merovingian court, or from Gelderland a province in The Netherlands or from Gunther (Gundicar), King of Burgundy or Gunderic, King of the Vandals. Hyperborea Finland, Russia and the Baltic countries (Hyperborea) was a land in “outermost north” according to Greek historian Herodotus. Howard’s Hyperborea is described as the first Hyborian kingdom, “which had its beginning in a crude fortress of boulders heaped to repel tribal attack”. Hyrkania Mongolia, Hyrcania. In classical geography, a region southeast of the Caspian Sea or Hyrcanian Sea corresponding to the Iranian provinces of Golestan, Mazandaran and Gilan. The name is Greek for the Old Persian Varkana, one of the Achaemenid Empire satrapies, and survives in the name of the river Gorgan. The original meaning may have been “wolf land”. In Iranian legend, Hyrcania was remarkable for its wizards, demons, wolves, spirits, witches and vampires. Iranistan An eastern land corresponding to modern Iran. Historically, the name of the country is derived from the Iran + the Persian <i>istan</i>, <i>estan</i>, “country”. Kambuja/Kambulja The original name of Cambodia, also known as Kampuchea. Keshan The name comes from the “Kesh”, the Egyptian name for Nubia. Khauran The name perhaps derives from the Hauran region of Syria. Khitai China. The name is derived from the Khitan Empire (Chinese 遼朝 Liáo cháo or the Liao Dynasty）and people that ruled northern and northeastern China. The namei is derived from the Khitan language for ‘The Khitan Empire’, Mos diau-d kitai huldʒi gur; in modern Mandarin Chinese, 契丹國 or <i>Qìdān guó</i>. ‘Khita’ is also the origin of the Russian name for China, “Kitai” (<i>Китай</i>), which is related to the English word “Cathay” and Marco Polo’s Cathay (/kæˈθeɪ/). In the Hyborian age, Khitai is an ancient empire which is always at war with Kambuja to the south. The people of Khitai are yellow-skinned and of medium height. Khitai is ruled by a God-Emperor whose decisions are greatly influenced by The Scarlet Circle, a clan of some of the most powerful mage lords in all of Hyboria. Khitan laws flow from the overlord of the city-state. The culture of Khitai is similar to that of ancient China. The most prominent feature of Khitai is its Great Wall (similar to Great Wall of China) which protects it from foreign invasions from the north. The cities of Khitai are Ruo-Chen, Shu-Chen, Shaulum and the capital Paikang which contains the Jade Citadel, from where the God-Emperor rules over all of Khitai. Khoraja Constantinople and the Etruscans. and possibly the associated Principality of Antioch, County of Edessa and County of Tripoli, collectively known as Outremer. The name itself was inspired by the references of Sax Rohmer to the fictional city of <i>Khorassa</i> in <i>The Mask of Fu Manchu</i> novel. Kosala From the ancient Indo-Aryan kingdom of Kosala, corresponding roughly in area with the region of Oudh. Kozaki Semi-barbaric steppe-dwelling raiders analogous to the Cossacks. Koth From the ancient Hittites (the name <i>Koth</i> may come from the fact that the Hittites are called in the Bible the <i>children of Heth</i>, and the Egyptians called their land <i>Kheta</i>); The Kothian capital of Khorshemish corresponds to the Hittite capital of Carchemish. Perhaps from <i>The Sign of Koth</i> in <i>The Dream-Quest of Unknown Kadath</i> by H. P. Lovecraft. There is a town of Koth in Gujarat, India, but the connection is doubtful. Howard also used the same name in his interplanetary novel <i>Almuric</i>. Kusan Probably from the Kushan Empire. Kush From the kingdom of Kush, Nubia, North Africa. Meru Tibet. In Hindu mythology, Meru is the sacred mountain upon which the gods dwell.<b>NOTE:</b> Meru is not an original Hyborian Age country and was created by L. Sprague de Camp and Lin Carter for “The City of Skulls“. Nemedia A cross between Rome and Byzantium. Nemedia was the rival of Aquilonia (which corresponds to The Carolingians), and depended on Aesir mercenaries for their defence (as the Byzantine Empire hired Vikings as the Varangian Guard). The name comes from Nemed, leader of colonists from Scythia to Ireland in Irish mythology; perhaps the name is also meant to allude to Nemea, home to the Nemean Lion of Greek mythology. The name may also be suggestive of various names for Germany in Slavic languages, e.g. Czech <i>Německo</i>. Ophir Ancient Ophir, a gold-mining region in the Old Testament, possibly on the shores of the Red Sea or Arabian Sea (e.g. western Arabia), though clearly Howard saw it as situated somewhere in Italy. Pathenia Central Asia, probably Afghanistan. The name comes from the Greek word <i>Parthenia</i> meaning “virgin” or “untouched” since Pathenia is a forbidden country and its landscape has largely remain untouched from any human activity. It contains the dreaded snow apes and Yahlgan, the sacred city of Erlik, the flame-god.<b>NOTE:</b> Pathenia is not an original Hyborian Age country. It appeared first in Marvel‘s Conan the Barbarian comics. Pelishtim Philistines (<i>P’lishtim</i> in Hebrew). The Pelishti city of Asgalun derives its name from Ashkelon. The Pelisti god Pteor or Baal-Pteor derives its name from the Moabite Baal-Peor. Picts Pre-Columbian America, with an overlay of North America during the European colonization of the Americas, possibly even colonial-era New York. Howard bestows names from Iroquoian languages on many of his Hyborian-Age Picts (but not the quasi-historical Picts featuring Bran Mak Morn). Note that the name “Pict” comes from the Latin language term for “painted one”, which could be applicable to a number of the Indigenous peoples of the Americas. The historical termed Picts were a confederation of Celtic tribes in central and northern Scotland which bordered Roman Britain. Poitain A combination of Poitou and Aquitaine, two regions in southwestern France. From the 10th to the mid-12th century, the counts of Poitou were also the dukes of Aquitaine. Punt The Land of Punt on the Horn of Africa. A place with which the ancient Egyptians traded, probably Somaliland. Shem Mesopotamia, Syria, Palestine, and Arabia. In the Bible, Shem is Noah‘s eldest son, the ancestor of the Hebrews, Arabs and Assyrians; hence, the modern “Semite” and Semitic languages (via Greek <i>Sem</i>), used properly to designate the family of languages spoken by these peoples. Stygia Egypt. The name comes from Styx, a river of the Greek underworld in Greek mythology. In earlier times the territory of Stygia included Shem, Ophir, Corinthia, and part of Koth. Stygia is ruled by a theocracy of sorcerer-kings.The people are dark skinned. Most of the common people are descendants of the various races across the world. They worship the serpent god Set. Stygia’s terrain is a mix of mountains, desert, plains, and marshes. The Styx river flows through Stygia into the sea. Turan Persian name for Turkestan. A Turkish land, possibly referring to the Gokturk Empire, the Timurid Empire, or the Seljuk Empire. The name derives from Turan, the areas of Eurasia occupied by speakers of Ural–Altaic languages. The names of the various Turanian cities (e.g. Aghrapur, Sultanapur, Shahpur) are often in Persian language. King Yezdigerd is named after Yazdegerd III, ruler of the Sassanid Empire. The name of King Yildiz means <i>star</i> in the Turkish language. The city of Khawarizm takes its name from Khwarezm, and Khorusun from Khorasan. Uttara Kuru From the medieval Uttara Kuru Kingdom at the north and central of Pakistan.<b>NOTE:</b> Uttara Kuru is not an original Hyborian Age country. Vanaheim Dark Age Scandinavia. Vanaheim is the home of the Vanir in Norse mythology Vendhya India (the Vindhya Range is a range of hills in central India). The name means “rent” or “ragged”, i.e. having many passes. Wadai (tribe) The Wadai Empire in present-day Chad. Wazuli (tribe) The Waziri tribe in northwest Pakistan. Zamora The Romani people. The name comes from the city of Zamora, Zamora province, Castile-León, Spain, alluding to the Gitanos of Spain (see <i>Zingara</i> for discussion); or possibly it is based on the word “Roma”. There may also be some reference to southern Italy, as Zamorans dance the tarantella in honor of their spider-god (variously known as Omm and Zath). Also hints of ancient Israel and Palestine. Zembabwei The Munhumutapa Empire. The name comes from Great Zimbabwe, a ruined fortified town in Rhodesia, first built around the 11th century and used as the capital of the Munhumutapa Empire. Oddly, this is the same root as the modern name for the Republic of Zimbabwe. Zingara Spain/Portugal. Iberian Peninsula as a whole. <i>Zingara</i> is also Italian for “Gipsy woman”; this may mean that Howard mixed up the source names of Zingara and Zamora, with Zingara originally meant to apply to the Roma kingdom, and Zamora to the Spanish kingdom. Zuagir (tribe) The name is perhaps derived from a combination of Tuareg and Uyghur.21/04/2017 at 10:38 #60946
So for my games around Shem and Turan I am using Egyptian or Greek style models.
For Iranistan I am using Iranians and the like.
To be fair I am assuming a lot of trade and travel and that clothing and skin tones transcend physical borders.
I am using Copplestone Barbarians for my Heroes.
I am also using Copplestone Picts as my Black Kingdom tribesmen, as I feel they work well.
Xyston and Magister Militum have some nice historical’s that I feel fit the bill.
This map may help people get a feel for where is where?
- This reply was modified 2 months ago by Angel Barracks.
- This reply was modified 2 months ago by Angel Barracks.
Size Matters! -http://angelbarracks.co.uk/21/04/2017 at 12:42 #60960
Tony Bath’s Hyborian campaign simply used approximate historical equivalents (originally 40mm flats!). Back then there wasn’t a lot of choice of course.
These days there are plenty of choices in the 15mm-18mm ranges. One issue may be that Howards countries were based on different historical eras, as well as being geographically scattered. It depends on whether you’re happy to have eg Imperial Roman infantry fighting Tibetan heavy cavalry (& yetis). It’s no less historical than most of the WRG/DBA matchups though!
As usual, Eureka can provide some suitably obscure ranges http://eurekamin.com.au/index.php?cPath=87_102
A couple of other sites to start with, both US based but I’ve shipped to Oz from both on many occasions without difficulty:
Splintered Light for Vikings, Romano-British, Saxons, Scots-Irish, Skraelings & Picts http://www.splinteredlightminis.com/ They also have some more egenreric ‘fantasy Arabian’ figures. I’ve got some of David’s other figures which are really nice.
Khurasan: for lots of the central Asian/steppe tribes,Late Romans/ Byzantines & lots of others. Again lovely figures, if sometimes on the larger side (18mm rather than 15mm). Service can be erratic as Jon closes the webshop if he’s travelling on business, which happens every month or so. http://khurasanminiatures.tripod.com/index.html21/04/2017 at 17:23 #60987
shelldrake, you’ve had a couple of thoughtful answers to your OP, so I’m going to go haring off on a tangent. Fair warning, ignore me if you’re easily annoyed.
Part of the charm of REH’s Hyboria is the naive caricatures he created of various historical cultures, Egyptians and Romans and Zulus and Knights of different eras, all jumbled up together, beating on each other with blunt objects. All of them seem to be drawn from some colorful, illustrated, c.1920 Big Golden Boy’s Wonder Book of World History. Although REH wrote pulp text, his fiction translates very well into cartoon art. Many of us know Conan and his world as much from the derivative comic books (Franzetta!) as from REH’s original stories.
Many wargamers have done what REH did; pulled figures from their historical wargame collections, Greeks and Assyrians and Turks and American Indians, and jumbled them up into an Hyborian Campaign. I’ve played in a few of those, they were good fun.
But I have sometimes thought…that 1/72 plastic figures would best present the comic art aesthetic of REH’s pulpy Hyborian Age. Esci Zulus and Pathans, Italieri Woodland Indians, Nexus Egyptians, Airfix Robin Hood Yeomen, all jumbled up together in their awkward flat poses with paint flaking off them, jabbing each other with pointy sticks.
I’ll never start the project. I think just about it sometimes, and smile.
You'll shoot your eye out, kid!22/04/2017 at 01:29 #60999
Thanks for the replies so far.
This is a good excuse to read my books again too
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