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This topic contains 40 replies, has 23 voices, and was last updated by Ivan Sorensen Ivan Sorensen 1 week ago.

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  • #74886
    Mike
    Mike
    Keymaster

    “It’s Vasel’s status as an authority figure within the tabletop gaming space that makes his statements, delivered as part of a series called Board Game Breakfast, all the more troubling.”

    “I may not necessarily want to play a game where there’s a bunch of people cursing up a storm at one table or speaking sexist, misogynistic talk at another table or treating me like scum because I just wanted to join their gaming group,”

    Because that never happens online?

    LINK

    Should I worry that I have not heard of him?

    #74887

    zippyfusenet
    Participant

    Should I worry that I have not heard of him?

    I never heard of him either. But you got me to click on the story. Hi-ho.

    You'll shoot your eye out, kid!

    #74888

    Etranger
    Participant

    Neither have I, nor of his ‘organisation’. A legend in his own mind perhaps?

    #74889
    Rhoderic
    Rhoderic
    Participant

    I think I’ve heard of the Dice Tower Network and one or two of the podcasts in it before, but only very peripherally.

    This controversy seems to be mainly to do with the boardgame community, and the non-wargame boardgame community at that.

    • This reply was modified 3 weeks, 2 days ago by Rhoderic Rhoderic.
    #74891
    Not Connard Sage
    Not Connard Sage
    Participant

    Who?

     

    "I go online sometimes, but everyone's spelling is really bad. It's... depressing."

    #74896
    Guy Farrish
    Guy Farrish
    Participant

     

     

    I love it that the segment he messed up in was called ‘Tom Thinks’!

    Not long enough or hard enough apparently.

    Save me from self appointed ‘authority figures’

    #74897

    Dan Kennedy
    Participant

    I spend quite a lot of time on BGG; Tom Vasel is highly thought of by many.

    I am not one of them.

    It always astonishes me how big fish in very small ponds lose their sense of perspective…

    #74913

    McKinstry
    Participant

    I have heard of Dice Tower although I’d not heard of Tom Vasel. Having clicked on the link, his absence from my awareness was no loss on my part.

    One more internet twit that looks as if he could use a little less time at the keyboard and a bit more time outside actually moving around.

    Never wrestle with a pig. You both get muddy and the pig just likes it.

    #74914

    “Game nerd expresses opinion. Other game nerds profess to being troubled by said opinion.”

    A situation as rare as hen’s teeth!

    http://prufrockian-gleanings.blogspot.jp/

    #74916
    Phil Dutré
    Phil Dutré
    Participant

    Never heard of the guy.

    I do visit BGG regularly to look up things, but usually don’t bother reading reviews. I prefer to discover and appreciate games by playing them, not by reading what other people think of them. And yes, that sometimes means I wasted money on games that turned out to less liked by my gaming group, but I consider that part of the gaming experience.

    • This reply was modified 3 weeks, 2 days ago by Phil Dutré Phil Dutré.
    #74987
    durecellrabbit
    durecellrabbit
    Participant

    I’ve heard of him but have not followed him. Honestly I don’t really pay much attention to anyone in the hobby as an authority figure.

    #74988
    norm smith
    norm smith
    Participant

    There is a heavily subscribed thread on part of this over on BoardGameGeek, where views abound 🙂

    Disclosure …. I gave a ‘thumbs up’ to the comment by CasualCasual at the bottom of page one, because I also want my town centre (in the UK) to prosper and be diverse (it isn’t, its dying!)

    LINK –

    https://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/1859745/tom-vasels-thoughts-save-local-game-store-movement

     

    http://commanders.simdif.com

    #74996
    Not Connard Sage
    Not Connard Sage
    Participant

    On further reflection, I:

    Hardly ever play boardgames these days.

    Don’t have a friendly local gaming store.

    Have never played a game at a FLGS.

    Hardly likely to ever play a game at a FLGS.

    Am not American.

    Therefore Tom Vasal, whoever he is, is irrelevant.

    Charles Vasey however, was/is a different bucket of dice 🙂

    "I go online sometimes, but everyone's spelling is really bad. It's... depressing."

    #74998
    John D Salt
    John D Salt
    Participant

    Charles Vasey however, was/is a different bucket of dice 🙂

    Indeed, my initial reaction to the headline was to think “someone can’t spell ‘Vasey'”.

    All the best,

    John.

    #75003
    kyoteblue
    kyoteblue
    Participant

    How, odd.

    #75010
    Guy Farrish
    Guy Farrish
    Participant

    I confess I thought we were talking about the Vassalengine – a way of playing boardgames online:

    VASSAL

     

    #75074
    Cerdic
    Cerdic
    Participant

    I was going to reply but find that Connard Sage has already said everything that needed to be said!

    Etranger – or, legend in his own lunchbreak…

     

    #75094

    warwell
    Participant

    I’ve heard of him, and find his reviews very useful. But then I’m an American who plays many board games.

    I didn’t watch the video but from the article I’d say that many of his comments are accurate. I don’t buy much, or ever play, at the FLGS. For me, the internet is my connection to the broader gaming community. It also sounds like he’s had bad experiences gaming at the FLGS. It doesn’t really surprise me.

    #75104

    Etranger
    Participant

    Deleted. Sorry Mike

    • This reply was modified 3 weeks ago by  Etranger.
    #75106
    Mike
    Mike
    Keymaster

     

    Not cool to make fun of people because of their appearance.

     

    #75107
    William Harley
    William Harley
    Participant

    ???

    If it helps I am a legend in my own lunch break.

    #75109
    Mike
    Mike
    Keymaster

    ??? If it helps I am a legend in my own lunch break.

    A few comments have been made about his weight.

    #75110
    Ochoin
    Ochoin
    Participant

    We live in a time where you can become a celebrity for doing little or nothing. It simply doesn’t bother me  if Tom Vasal is pukka ‘Personality’ or not.

    I have many friends on TWW I haven’t met & probably will never meet. That’s weird if you stop to think about it. There’s characters on TOW (The Other Website) who I equally have never met & whom I despise – admittedly with greater justification for their extremist &/or distasteful views. So a Wargaming Personality isn’t anything out of the ordinary nor anything to rail against.

    Certainly, if his point is he doesn’t want to game with objectionable people, I can’t criticise him.

     

    donald

    • This reply was modified 3 weeks ago by Ochoin Ochoin.
    • This reply was modified 3 weeks ago by Ochoin Ochoin.
    • This reply was modified 3 weeks ago by Ochoin Ochoin.
    #75127
    Thaddeus Blanchette
    Thaddeus Blanchette
    Participant

    Another way of looking at it is that we live in a time where you can specialize to a ridiculous degree. Tom is indeed a “boardgaming celebrity”. As we’ve seen, that’s such a specialized niche that it doesn’t even extend to miniatures gaming.

    I just relax and enjoy the fact that I am a 3mm sci-fi miniatures wargaming celebrity. Although Mat’s slowly taking that title from me: the Lady Gaga to my Madonna. 🙂

    Warhol got it wrong. In this brave new world, everyone will be famous for far longer than fifteen minutes. But only for about a half dozen people or so.

    We get slapped around, but we have a good time!

    #75135
    Rhoderic
    Rhoderic
    Participant

    I just relax and enjoy the fact that I am a 3mm sci-fi miniatures wargaming celebrity.

    I’m sorry, do I know you?

    #75156
    Thaddeus Blanchette
    Thaddeus Blanchette
    Participant

    I just relax and enjoy the fact that I am a 3mm sci-fi miniatures wargaming celebrity.

    I’m sorry, do I know you?

    No, but the chicks dig it.

    We get slapped around, but we have a good time!

    #75232
    Noel
    Noel
    Participant

    I’ve always been a board gamer, but these days I’m much more of a board gamer than a miniatures gamer (that has not always been the case).

    Tom was one of the early online board game reviewers and he has managed to build up a brand, a company, a convention, a charity and a full time job out of it.  He’s been a consultant to board game publishers.

    The Dice Tower is something of a giant in board game reviewing.  There are several people that have been able to monetize their reviewing and have become minor celebrities, but the Dice Tower is the most successful of them.  There is no denying that he has a measurable influence on the industry.

    I don’t particularly like their reviews and the personalities of the reviewers.  Their approach is Quantity Over Quality.  It’s been discussed that they only play games once or twice before reviewing them these days, which is in contrast to Tom’s earlier, more in depth reviews.  Tom is a pastor (as is one of the other reviewers on his site) and, occasionally, his religious views impact his game reviews.

    The ‘movement’ to support local stores creates some friction in online discussions and manufacturers that offer deeper discounts to brick and mortar shops are often the subject of derision — just look at the comments section on the linked article.  Tom threw himself into this and it came to light that he has some partnership or business interest in one of the big online game retailers.

     

    #75244
    Rhoderic
    Rhoderic
    Participant

    Isn’t it also true that the boardgame community and the boardgame industry are much bigger than their miniature gaming counterparts? Like, orders of magnitude bigger?

    Or am I misremembering some old forum discussions I’ve read about this topic elsewhere in the miniature gaming community?

    #75245
    Mike
    Mike
    Keymaster

    Isn’t it also true that the boardgame community and the boardgame industry are much bigger than their miniature gaming counterparts? Like, orders of magnitude bigger? Or am I misremembering some old forum discussions I’ve read about this topic elsewhere in the miniature gaming community?

    It would not surprise me.

    #75250
    Rhoderic
    Rhoderic
    Participant

    Not to get too far off topic, but I must admit that I find the “geography of geekdom” rather interesting. If boardgaming (even excluding stuff like chess and Monopoly) is like the London Metropolitan Area, then miniature gaming is probably like Stoke-on-Trent or something.

    “Probably” meaning “I’m just pretending I know what I’m talking about” in this case 

    #75251
    John D Salt
    John D Salt
    Participant

    If boardgaming (even excluding stuff like chess and Monopoly) is like the London Metropolitan Area, then miniature gaming is probably like Stoke-on-Trent or something.

    Much easier to get oatcakes in Stoke than in London.

    All the best,

    John.

    #75255
    Guy Farrish
    Guy Farrish
    Participant

    NB That’s Staffordshire Oatcakes to the rest of the UK (and world).

    Not to confused with the Scottish imitation:

    #75258
    Rhoderic
    Rhoderic
    Participant

    I’m a Britophile foodie; I make Staffordshire oatcakes on occasion and I love them 

    We’re still on topic, right? Yeah, we’re on topic.

    • This reply was modified 2 weeks, 5 days ago by Rhoderic Rhoderic.
    • This reply was modified 2 weeks, 5 days ago by Rhoderic Rhoderic.
    #75262
    Victoria Dickson
    Victoria Dickson
    Participant

    Not to get too far off topic, but I must admit that I find the “geography of geekdom” rather interesting. If boardgaming (even excluding stuff like chess and Monopoly) is like the London Metropolitan Area, then miniature gaming is probably like Stoke-on-Trent or something. “Probably” meaning “I’m just pretending I know what I’m talking about” in this case

    I think board wargaming is well down on where it used to be, the original big publishers disappeared at the end of the last century.  European style games and Big Box games with plastic figures seem to have taken their place on game shop shelves.  All the great board wargame magazines went too so far as I know, The General, Fire and Movement, The Grenadier.  You can still get the old style games, but they do seem more of a niche thing now. 🙁

     

    #75267
    Rhoderic
    Rhoderic
    Participant

    Not to get too far off topic, but I must admit that I find the “geography of geekdom” rather interesting. If boardgaming (even excluding stuff like chess and Monopoly) is like the London Metropolitan Area, then miniature gaming is probably like Stoke-on-Trent or something. “Probably” meaning “I’m just pretending I know what I’m talking about” in this case

    I think board wargaming is well down on where it used to be, the original big publishers disappeared at the end of the last century. European style games and Big Box games with plastic figures seem to have taken their place on game shop shelves. All the great board wargame magazines went too so far as I know, The General, Fire and Movement, The Grenadier. You can still get the old style games, but they do seem more of a niche thing now. 🙁

    Yeah, I was referring mainly to Eurogames and “Big Box” type games.

    To me, that’s the standard, natural definition of boardgames in the up-to-date sense. As someone just barely young enough to qualify as a Millennial by a hair’s breadth, I honestly have a difficult time imagining a scenario in which I could have come into contact with old-fashioned board wargames while growing up. They just weren’t around. Eurogames and “Big Box” games were, alongside their contemporaries like CCGs and – obviously – video games.

    #75268
    Victoria Dickson
    Victoria Dickson
    Participant
    #75275
    Noel
    Noel
    Participant

    As a teenager, I spent months taking a weekly, hour-long train ride after school to go to a shop that carried Avalon Hill games, just so I could hold the box of The Longest Day while I saved up for it.

    I used to dream of collecting ASL and going to conventions to play in tournaments.

    I read the print-only catalog that came in each game’s box and fantasized what wonders each title would bring.

     

    #75281
    craig cartmell
    craig cartmell
    Participant

    As Minister at The Ministry of Gentlemanly Warfare one set some junior secretaries to check this chap’s credentials.

    Apparently he is a colonial who was brought up by Amish wolves in a cave, and all he had to play with was a half-eaten copy of Monopoly. He is revered by the sort of people who think their current President is doing “a great job” and that “D&D is the Devil’s gateway”.

    One has tried very hard, but one cannot muster up a fuck to give on his pronouncements.

    Cheers,
    Craig

    The Ministry of Gentlemanly Warfare

    #75284
    Phil Dutré
    Phil Dutré
    Participant

    Not to get too far off topic, but I must admit that I find the “geography of geekdom” rather interesting. If boardgaming (even excluding stuff like chess and Monopoly) is like the London Metropolitan Area, then miniature gaming is probably like Stoke-on-Trent or something.

    It evolves over time. When you look at the gaming hobby as a whole, different gaming subgenres have been the most popular. Board wargaming took that role during the 60 and 70s, when roleplaying took over, which was superceded by collectible cardgames in the midnineties, which was eclipsed by board gaming as we know it now around 2000. And perhaps 5 years from now it might be something else that has not been invented yet. Miniature wargaming is something special since it requires more commitment time-wise (painting and modeling), and hence attracts a base of gamers which only partly overlaps with the bigger mainstream evolutions.

    What specific gaming subgenre is the most prominent one is of course determined by commercial factors, but also by the technology of the day. E.g. CCG’s could not have been produced in the 70s, and current boardgames with their variety of components would have been difficult to produce in earleir decades – unless in mass quantities. Hence the profileration of a large number titles, each of which is produced in relátively small numbers compared to e.g. MB games in the 60s or 70s. These days, manufacturers can produce such detailed games at relatively low cost, and hence, boardgames are a popular format to publish these days.

     

     

    #75295
    Noel
    Noel
    Participant

    “D&D is the Devil’s gateway”

    It really is, though.

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