02/03/2015 at 15:39 #18835Henry HydeParticipant
I’m downscaling certain periods – literally – and Ancients is one of them. I like playing C&C Ancients and I’ve had fun using miniatures on Hexon terrain. But I know of others who use Impetus or DBA or even Hail Caesar, which for some reason I always associate with 28mm games.
So, do you do micro-ancients (6 or 10mm) and if so, what rules do you use, what size units, how do you base them etc?02/03/2015 at 16:04 #18836MikeKeymaster
I almost did, it was when back when I was selling the Irregular Miniatures Limited Ancients rules, they were nice and simple but seemed to capture what very little about the period I know.
If I did do 6mm ancients I would certainly try those rules out.02/03/2015 at 17:01 #18844A Lot of GaulParticipant
I’m afraid that I have never had much interest in 6mm or 10mm miniatures wargaming. For my own Ancients gaming, I play Hail Caesar with 18mm figures, and for me it works out very well.
Here are some links to posts by folks who play HC using 10mm figures, so you can see how the game plays for them:
"Ventosa viri restabit." ~ Harry Field02/03/2015 at 20:00 #18877JozisTinManParticipant
Henry, I have been going through a similar down scaling process, I guess technically for 10 years as that was when I sold all my 15mm ancients for Baccus 6mm.
When I get my head extracted from my modern project, I plan on using my already painted and based 6mm ancients with ‘To The Strongest.’ It gives you a lot of flexibility as to what base sizes you want to use, number of figures, etc. I personally am going to use 2 inch squares, as my figures were originally base on 40mm frontages for Warmaster Ancients. That will give me a lot of maneuver space and room from drinks on my 4×4 table.
If space were not an issue for me, I’d do 3 or 4 inch squares with big bases full of a ridiculous number of figures.
http://jozistinman.blogspot.com/02/03/2015 at 23:13 #18921Northern MonkeyParticipant
I have lots of War of the Roses stuff in 6mm (yeah I know its borderline ancients – but close enough) which I have based for Impetus, I have used the recommended 15mm base size so every- thing is on bases 8cm frontage with a varying depth of 2cm – 6cm depth depending on unit (skirmishers 2cm, hvy inf 3-4cm, light inf/archers 4cm, cav 6cm arty 4-6cm). I put between 25-45 minis on the infantry bases, apart from the skirmishers which have 10-16, cav varies between 10-20, arty 2-3 pieces +crew. Use the rules as if you are using 15mm minis.
I also play Warmaster ancients using 6mm and the regular basing conventions (ie 20mm x 40mm) it works fine as is, no need to change anything.
There are some pics on my blog of the WotR stuff , albeit not particularly good ones(its something im working on or would be if these 6mm Epic marines wouldn’t keep appearing on my painting desk!)
My attempt at a Blog: http://ablogofwar.blogspot.co.uk/03/03/2015 at 12:52 #18974David BlairParticipant
I started down-scaling years back in an attempt to have battles resemble battles. 25mm made way for 15mm, 15mm to 6mm then up to 10mm.
Went back to 6mm on 40mm wide bases with as many figures as I could fit.Sold the lot and did 2mm instead. The trouble I have is figure scale versus terrain,
they never work properly unless it’s a skirmish.The critical moment for me was 300 Huns against 240 Sarmatians on a 5′ x 3′ board, even in 6mm it looked like
With the 2mm I went for 1:2 figure ratio on 60mm wide bases then just bases then in correct formations,for example 8 ranks for Hoplites and 16 for Pikemen,
Irregulars foot varying from 189 figures to 240.
I’not suggesting you switch to 2mm but perhaps using a similar idea,picture how you imagine the troop formations looked then base them accordingly.
As for rules just adjust movement and shooting ranges how you see fit,with element based rules leave things as they are.Figure scale has no real impact
on play apart from a visual one .
Shelves bulging with rulebooks but not figures,800 bases are in 20 A4 slim box files on 1 shelf 3′ wide,It’s Rally Round The King and Ancient Battleline Clash
for me though Simon’s To the Strongest and Mark’s Sword and Spear are itching to be played too.03/03/2015 at 14:07 #18977Nick the LemmingParticipant
6mm Ancients for Impetus / Sword and Spear work well. They look good for any game in which one base is a unit, as you can use large bases and do a mini diorama that represents a warband, several ranks of Romans all in proper ranks, a couple of elephants rampaging with the odd foot skirmisher among them, etc. Of course, you can also do those in larger scales too (all my Sword and Spear stuff is on the same basing as Impetus, and is all 15mm), but you do get a suitably mass effect look with 6mm. One of my mates has a load, they look pretty good. I have a load of (I think Baccus, Rapier and Irregular) 6mm ancients back home that we used when DBM first came out, with a couple of dozen figures per base. Haven;t touched that game in years, but I’d happily use the same figures for Sword and Spear these days.04/03/2015 at 06:48 #19031Piyan GlupakParticipant
I do DBA with 6mm using 40mm wide bases. With infantry and cavalry, I put 4 times as many figures, usually in 2 ranks. For instance, a hoplite element (base) would have 2 ranks of 8 figures instead of 4 figures of 15mm size. For most kids of chariots, artillery and elephants I have 2 models on a base (I could only fit one scythed chariot on a base).
For normal (12 elements per side) DBA games I prefer my 15mm armies. However, for BBDBA (DBA with 36 elements per side) I much prefer the 6mm armies. When I do a new 6mm DBA army, I go for 36 bases per side.
Please excuse the poor painting and photography:-09/03/2015 at 03:25 #19352willbParticipant
I use 40mm DBX bases for most of my 6mm figures. The 40mm bases can always be combined to create larger bases for rules like impetus, but the larger bases cannot be separated for other rule sets.12/03/2015 at 07:53 #19550CerdicParticipant
I started 6mm Ancients using Warmaster Ancients, using 40mm x 20mm bases. On the basis that 6mm is all about ‘mass effect’, I filled each base with figures. So a base of close-ranked formed infantry has 24 figures on it. A unit of three bases is therefore 72 figures.
I also made the arbitrary decision that a ‘unit’ of Romans would represent a cohort. A full legion, with hangers on etc, is 750ish figures. I have a couple of these plus auxilliarys and stuff.
This basing scheme has been pretty flexible. I have used the same troops with several different rulesets with no real problems.12/03/2015 at 11:33 #19561Nick the LemmingParticipant
I use 40mm DBX bases for most of my 6mm figures. The 40mm bases can always be combined to create larger bases for rules like impetus, but the larger bases cannot be separated for other rule sets.
I use larger bases for Impetus and Sword and Spear, because they look better as mini dioramas than sticking 4 smaller bases to gether, and they’re much easier to move etc. I get around the problem of them being much bigger for games like DBA, DBM and FoG by not being interested in those games. 😀12/03/2015 at 13:08 #19570JozisTinManParticipant
@Richard Lee: VERY nice looking table! When I can get my head out of the 1980’s cold war and then the WSS, I plan on pulling out my 6mm ancients again and playing on a similarly sized table.
http://jozistinman.blogspot.com/23/03/2015 at 10:27 #20235Nic WrightParticipant
Yes, our group plays 6mm ancients in a big way. We have been playing Hail Caesar, which works perfectly fine with the smaller scale, but are planning on branching out into Sword and Spear (which looks really exciting).
All our stuff is based on 4omm wide bases which, as said above, can be (and usually are) combined to form larger units 80mm wide. For Hail Caesar, we just convert all measurements to cm rather than inches. Standard size units are 80mm wide, small units are 40mm wide. For Sword and Spear, we’d just use 80mm wide units as well.
Depth varies. All my non-skirmishers are on 40mm depth bases and stand between two and five ranks deep. my skirmishers are on 20mm deep bases and stand in a staggered line. A couple of photos below, or you can check out more here.
http://irregularwars.blogspot.co.uk/25/03/2015 at 15:43 #20509Henry HydeParticipant
Some great ideas here, guys, thank you! And Nic and Richard, thanks for the pics. The ‘mass’ effect is certainly what I’m hoping to achieve with 6mm, battles that really look like battles.
And I ‘accidentally’ bought Macedonian and later Achaemenid armies at Hammerhead. Oops! What am I like! So those huge phalanxes are just the ticket.25/03/2015 at 17:13 #20512Norm SParticipant
Nic, I like your bases crammed with figures, that gives a good aerial view.25/03/2015 at 17:25 #20516
I have been seriously contemplating a Roman 3mm DBA army with half-size bases.
We get slapped around, but we have a good time!25/03/2015 at 19:57 #20527PaintingLittleSoldiersParticipant
I’m tempted by 6mm ancients simply looking at the photos on Baccus’s website.25/03/2015 at 19:59 #20528Nic WrightParticipant
http://irregularwars.blogspot.co.uk/25/03/2015 at 20:47 #20531
Birds do it
Bees do it
Even educated fleas do it
Let’s do it
Lets play microscale 6mm ancients.
We get slapped around, but we have a good time!28/03/2015 at 14:39 #20744Howard WhitehouseParticipant
I have 6mm Caesarian Romans and Gauls, bought painted at a convention many years ago. Lovely paint jobs, dead cheap. I then spent twice as much money adding to the forces.
I do all my own stunts.28/03/2015 at 16:47 #20755
6mm Ancients are a joy, a pleasure, a wondrous thing, everyone should do it.
Admittedly I have an interest in this as I am part of Rapier Miniatures and their excellent range of 6mm Ancients which match Baccus perfectly in size.
Ruleswise I will be using ‘To the Strongest’ when I get around to actually doing some armies, probably on double Impetus bases like the ones Mike Solway does. (he of the 6mm Painting clinic at various Northern and Midland Shows.)
If you really want to see what 6mm can do, and you can get to Sheffield come to the Joy of Six Show on the 19th of July.29/03/2015 at 16:07 #20855willbParticipant
I use a mix of 20mm (used for some Warmaster Ancients units) 80mm (ease of moving large pike blocks) and mostly 40mm
See31/03/2015 at 12:07 #21067TartyParticipant
If I was going to do 6mm I would go full size 28mm Impetus bases ( 120mm x 60mm mostly ) You could really go to town. Have infantry units half way through formation changes or cavalry charging in waves would be serious fun I think. Too much still to do on my 28s to get into another scale…..sadly.13/11/2019 at 02:52 #126377
Well, I finally have my 3mm Romans. I want to base them for Warmaster AND Triumph/DBA.
So, a question…
If I use 40mm width bases, does it really matter what depth they are if I play Warmaster? For example, can an artillery unit based at 40x40mm for DBA/Triumph work fine as an artillery unit for Warmaster?
We get slapped around, but we have a good time!13/11/2019 at 04:48 #126379McKinstryParticipant
I do 6mm Ancients using primarily Baccus figures. I strongly prefer rules that are 1 base equals 1 unit so I go with Impetus or Hail Caesar.
The tree of Life is self pruning.13/11/2019 at 13:04 #126395Mike HeaddenParticipant
My 10mm stuff is used for Warmaster Ancients and based on 40mm x 20mm MDF bases.
6mm Late Roman stuff is based for DBA on 15mm base sizes, so I can cram more figures on.
My 6mm Mesopotamian Early Bronze Age figures are based on 60mm square MDF bases, 48 close formed infantry/ 32 tribal infantry/ 16 light infantry/ 6 “Donkey Carts”/ a general and either 24 guardsmen or 3 chariots to a base. I’m back to working on a home brew set of rules for these.
There are 100 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who can work from incomplete data13/11/2019 at 13:08 #126396
We get slapped around, but we have a good time!13/11/2019 at 17:29 #126414ian pillayParticipant
I have two very small (no pun intended) Raiper miniatures Greek and Persian based on 30mm square bases for NT’s one hour wargames rules. Really cost effective and dead easy to paint. Plus all the other benefits of 6mm, scenery, painting times….etc
Tally-Ho! Check out my blog at…..
http://steelcitywargaming.wordpress.com/13/11/2019 at 20:20 #126426ian pillayParticipant
Tally-Ho! Check out my blog at…..
http://steelcitywargaming.wordpress.com/30/11/2019 at 17:04 #127402
Warmaster ancients give a decent game, but my poisen of choice is, ‘to the strongest’ best of all, any element based armies will fit those rules.04/12/2019 at 12:41 #127574Sane MaxParticipant
I always think it’s a great pity Warmaster Ancients didn’t quite storm the world of wargaming – it’s fairly popular, but not massively so. I don’t think any era looks quite as good in 6mm as Ancients do.
Mine are all based on 40*20 , and I have never found it a problem when playing other games.
Hail Caesar is really just Warmaster Anicents Lite, and I find the same base conventions for 6mm and 15mm to be the vest way to go.05/12/2019 at 07:28 #127618Piyan GlupakParticipant
@Sane Max – One of the things that I like about 6mm is that I prefer all (or most) of the bases to be the samer depth. I don’t think that I could fit chariots on 20mm deep bases, though.
This year, I re-based nearly all my 6mm ancients armies on to 60mm wide by 30mm deep bases. I am pleased with the results, although they need a slightly deeper battle field. The rules that I am participating in writing would normally want a 36″ deep board for 60mm wide bases, but because all the bases are 30mm deep, with careful deployment, you can get away with a 30″ deep board.
By the way, I tried Warmaster when it came out, and thought that it wasn’t bad as a fantasy game. I haven’t tried Warmaster Ancients, but suspect that there could be worse choices available.05/12/2019 at 08:32 #127621
Warmaster Ancients is a better game than the Fantasy, lots of little tidyups happened.
My 6mms are on credid card sized bases. (Except the elephants.)05/12/2019 at 09:14 #127622Daniele VParticipant
Who makes the beautiful 6mm Sumerians?05/12/2019 at 12:21 #127641Mike HeaddenParticipant
the Sumerians are from Rapier Miniatures (http://www.rapierminiatures.co.uk/) who are, frustratingly, currently closed while a revamp of the website and physical work space are undertaken.
However, they do say Rapier Miniatures will reopen in January 2020.
Rapier’s ordering system, like the mills of god, grind slow but grind exceeding fine 🙂 Never had an order fail to arrive, never had one arrive promptly. Worth the wait IMHO, YMMV!!
They are in scale with Baccus (https://www.baccus6mm.com/) who don’t do Mesopotamian Early Bronze Age but do make many figures that will do to fill the ranks of Sumer’s enemies. I even have some of their Amazons to add some feisty ladies to my “Civil Defence Forces” … gotta protect the real estate somehow 🙂
There are 100 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who can work from incomplete data
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