Chickenhawks Over New Guinea

[Just Jack]

All,

1130 local time
13 May 1942
New Guinea

Greetings all, having just wrapped up the Coral Sea battles, I figured it’s time to head back to my U.S. Army Air Corps fighter squadron, the 565th Tactical Fighter Squadron, better known as the “Chickenhawks.”  The last we saw of the Chickenhawks was back in February of 1942; they’d started out fighting the Japanese over the Dutch East Indies before falling back to Australia and becoming embroiled in the fighting over Darwin.  After things quieted down there, they ended up moving over to Brisbane, where they had a quiet period of daily patrolling to bring in replacements and get them trained up.  But they got word at the end of April that they’d be moving soon, and immediately after the Battle of Coral Sea they packed up and shipped out, heading up to Port Moresby on New Guinea, making Kila Kila Airfield, AKA “3 Mile Drome,” their new home on 11 May 1942.  They only had a couple days before they were called to action, air raid sirens warning of incoming Japanese aircraft called the Army pilots to their planes, with six of them getting aloft to intercept the enemy.

The Americans are facing Japanese fighters of the Tainan Kokutai based at Lae, New Guinea.  I created a table and rolled up the Japanese pilot skills; they have eighteen fighter pilots, ranked as follows:
2 Natural Born Killers
2 Aces
8 Veterans
5 Regulars
1 Rookies

The Americans have:
2 Aces
2 Veterans
7 Regulars
7 Rookies

I plan to play out my (semi-)normal series of seven fights.  I’ve created a table that I roll on to determine if its a fighter sweep, Americans defend, or Japanese defend.

The Americans bravely take their P-40 Warhawks into combat, and the Japanese are their usual, bold selves…

With their usual, bold, results.

But the Yanks are doing what they can to make it interesting.

To see how the Chickenhawks fared, please check the blog at:
https://oldleadbreed.blogspot.com/2019/10/chickenhawks-over-new-guinea-1.html

More to come!

V/R,
Jack

[kyoteblue]

That sucked,

[Just Jack]

I’m getting used to it…

V/R,

Jack

[Darkest Star Games]

Ya, wow.  At least the flight leader was smart enough to pull out rather than lose the entire flight.

"I saw this in a cartoon once, but I'm pretty sure I can do it..."

[Just Jack]

Yeah, we’ve got to start thinking about force preservation or there won’t be anyone left!

Jack

[Deleted User]

Hmmm Zero 01 in green, I think we could call him Green 01.

Here’s an idea, have a ‘Shark Roll’ for pilots who bailed out over water, I hear that part of teh world is full of wildlife 😀
Get modifier for being injured.
It really was the first thing that came to mind after reading the AAR.

[kyoteblue]

Nooooooooooo Sharks!!!!!

[Just Jack]

The first thing you thought of was sharks???  You’re killing me!  And when are you going to post some more air mercenaries, or lurkers, or special operations janitors?

Don’t worry, John, I’m not adding sharks, I’m having a hard enough problem keeping my pilots alive…  You’re not going to believe your eyes when you see my next project! 😉

V/R,
Jack

[kyoteblue]

Please don’t let your next project be 2 mm Nappys!!!!

 

[Deleted User]

Just Jack wrote:

The first thing you thought of was sharks??? You’re killing me! And when are you going to post some more air mercenaries, or lurkers, or special operations janitors?

When the first guy got short down and wounded, I was thinking I’d hate to be floating around in the ocean and bleeding.

I’ve been thinking about all those games, especially Air Mercs and finalizing the fantasy campaign, BUT, no more minis until I can run a 6 minute mile. I need cardio for steady my hands in next sculpting marathon.

[Darkest Star Games]

Deleted User wrote:

no more minis until I can run a 6 minute mile

i haven’t been able to do that since High school!  My best mile as an adult has been 7:20.  My knees just aren’t what they used to be.  Had I this restriction I’d never be able to game again.  (though my wife might be a bit happier as I’d then have to get to that Honey Do list…)

"I saw this in a cartoon once, but I'm pretty sure I can do it..."

[Deleted User]

I have never been able to do it even in high school, but I’m hoping to cross it off my bucket list before the end of the year. Never was a runner.

[Whirlwind]

Interesting stuff Jack and a great report.  Hard luck on those USAAF fliers though…

When I look at the performance details of the Zero and the P-40, the P-40 has never looked awful to me.  Are you marking down the P-40 as well as giving the Japanese the experience advantage?  The AVG’s kill claims seem amazingly over-inflated, but even adjusting for that, they don’t seem to have had such a miserable time against Japanese fighters.

[Deleted User]

My impression was P-40s might be evenly matched with Ki-43 and faster than Ki-27, their main adversaries. From what I remember reading they intercepted bombers and might have had advantage over the slower escorts. Got me curious about the kind of operations that went on in China.

[Just Jack]

Thomaston – So how old are you?  I haven’t been able to run 6-minute miles in about fifteen years, but back then we were running three of them, back to back to back 😉  Either way, not sure I understand your fascination with the phenomenon.

Kyote John – You’re in luck, no 2/3mm Napoleonics 😉  But I’m mum after that, shouldn’t have even brought it up until I was ready to unveil.  Just know that I’ve been building and painting like a @#$%…

Whirlwind John – Thanks man, and yeah, my Chickenhawks are having a rough time, much as the Killer Pelicans did.  It’s all about pilot quality.  Which brings us to the P-40 issue/comments; I don’t by any means think the P-40 was a piece of junk, but the historical record will reflect it didn’t have much (hardly any, actually) success against the Zero.  As Thomaston pointed out, a lot of the AVG’s success was against Nates and Claudes (don’t know much about their facing Oscars).  To be fair, nobody really had success against the Zero until the 2nd generation fighters came out (Hellcats, Corsairs, P-38s, P-47s, P-51s).   The P-40s, Hurricanes, Spitfires, especially not the Buffaloes, hell, even the USN and USMC victories in Wildcats were mostly against Bettys, Rufes, Mavises, Vals, Kates, etc…, and a lot of the successes by those same pilots in the Solomons were because the Americans were flying over their homes while the Zeros were coming all the way from Rabaul, seriously taxing the pilots and planes.

V/R,
Jack

[Whirlwind]

Yes, all true, but it goes back to my initial comments about the aircraft performance.  With the Wildcat, you can see how and why it would struggle.  With the P40, keeping the speed up, climb/dive rather than turn and use the better high-speed roll should have worked reasonably well, so I suspect a mixture of a relative lack of training and experience and some early faulty tactics were the root cause.

[Just Jack]

John,

Hmmm, I dunno man.  I think the Wildcat and the P-40 were about the same, performance wise, at least when applied to the concept of taking on a Zero.  That is to say, neither can turn with it, they both must stay away from dogfighting, stick strictly so slashing, high-side attacks, then dive through and escape, or at least disengage and attempt to reengage once they’ve gotten the altitude advantage again.  But all that’s hard to do in my simple dogfighting game that doesn’t even have altitude! 😉

And if I recall, we were expecting big (as in 15mm) gaming things from you in October.  You promised a surprise 😉

V/R,
Jack

[Deleted User]

I think I’m getting what Whirlwind is getting at. Specs wise P-40 is a little better than F4Fs, it has around the same speed as A6M.
I looked on Wiki and seems like P-40 wasn’t that bad but didn’t progress in the war because it had short range. The combat history section was a surprising read.

Just Jack wrote:

Either way, not sure I understand your fascination with the phenomenon

I watched several Crossfit Games events on youtube, can’t rememeber what year. Those women made running look easy, 6-minutes mile and they looked like they were leisurly jogging (while wearing weights no less). Wanted to see if I could do that, without any weights.

[Just Jack]

Thomaston,

I get what you guys are getting at and agree with the technical aspects of what you’re saying, I just don’t think the combat profile/capability for a Wildcat or P-40 vs a Zero is any different, so I don’t worry about it in game turns.  So this ends up making the P-40 a net loser in the games because 1) it’s not as capable a dog fighter as the Zero, and 2) the Army pilots aren’t trained as well (with regards to deflection shooting) as the USMC/USN pilots, so they’re in an even deeper hole.

My guess on why the P-40 just sort of went away was because of the next generation of fighter aircraft, but that actually doesn’t make sense as the Wildcat continued to be produced and serve all the way through the war (as the FM2 and Martlett).

And you dodged the age question 😉

V/R,

Jack

[Deleted User]

Just Jack wrote:

My guess on why the P-40 just sort of went away was because of the next generation of fighter aircraft, but that actually doesn’t make sense as the Wildcat continued to be produced and serve all the way through the war (as the FM2 and Martlett).

I think FM-2 only stayed on for so long because it was the only thing on the production line that could operate well from CVEs.
I was surprised to read P-40 actually saw use right up to 1944-45 and seemed pretty competitive in the Med…(don’t know how to spell).

Just Jack wrote:

Army pilots aren’t trained as well (with regards to deflection shooting) as the USMC/USN pilots, so they’re in an even deeper hole.

Is that bias right there? 😀

Just Jack wrote:

And you dodged the age question 😉

What you expect!! -_-‘

[Whirlwind]

Just Jack wrote:

And if I recall, we were expecting big (as in 15mm) gaming things from you in October. You promised a surprise 😉

Haha yes, sorry.  The first game actually got set up on Saturday but had to be abandoned for family reasons.  I’ve got some work away this week, so it may slip a week or two unfortunately.

[zippyfusenet]

I’m just an aviation buff, not a pilot nor an aeronautical engineer, but my understanding of comparisons of P-40E Warhawk vs. F4F-3 Wildcat vs. A6M2 Zero vs. Ki.43 Hayabusa is:

The Allison liquid-cooled engine in the P-40 lacked a turbo-charger, so performance fell off badly at altitude, and the Warhawk couldn’t fight effectively above c. 15,000 feet. The Pratt & Whitney Twin Wasp in the F4F-3 had a two-stage super-charger, so the plane performed better at altitude. Most simple wargames present a fighter’s best performance at any altitude, so a Warhawk looks little different than a Wildcat, but really it is.

The A6M2 and the Ki.43 were both very light-weight designs. The  P-40 and F4F could both out-dive Japanese fighters. Claire Chenault trained his Flying Tiger pilots to dive into combat, make one firing pass and continue the dive to escape, then yo-yo back up and do it again if possible. Japanese fighters couldn’t follow a P-40 in a dive, but a Warhawk that tried to dogfight Japanese fighters often came to grief.

Performance envelopes of the Ki.43 and the A6M2 were similar, both climbed and turned well, rolled and dived poorly, but the Zero was a much more dangerous opponent than the Haybusa because it was more heavily armed. The Hayabusa had only two 7.7mm MGs, just like Snoopy and the Red Baron, while the Zero had those and two 20mm cannon in its wings. American fighters with self-sealing fuel tanks and pilot armor could often survive a raking from two 7.7mm MGs, but a hit or two from 20mm cannon could bring them down.

You'll shoot your eye out, kid!

[Just Jack]

Thomaston – It’s not bias, Sir, it’s fact that naval aviators were better trained then their Army Air Corps compatriots.  It has since narrowed to ‘Marines,’ all the other services, and in all aspects 😉  Regarding age, shifty little fella, eh?  Most likely you’re probably damn near 80, like most of the rest of the folks around here, though I’m secretly hoping you’re like some crazy 16-year old, just for the novelty, though it means we’ll lose you once you realize wargaming is for old men that can no longer go out there and do the stuff young men do.  I figure you’re in your 40s, maybe early 50s, still shy about coming out as a geek.  It took me awhile, too 😉

Whirlwind – Damn man, you can’t keep making the world wait! 😉  Hope all is well, and looking forward to it.

Zippy – Thanks for the data, I appreciate it.  Again I think all the Western aircraft were forced to dive and run, nobody could turn with (or even close to, certainly not in 1941-42) the Zero.

V/R,
Jack

 

[Just Jack]

All,

1130 local time
14 May 1942
New Guinea

Greetings all, having just wrapped up the Coral Sea battles, I figured it’s time to head back to my U.S. Army Air Corps fighter squadron, the 565th Tactical Fighter Squadron, better known as the “Chickenhawks.” The last we saw of the Chickenhawks was back in February of 1942; they’d started out fighting the Japanese over the Dutch East Indies before falling back to Australia and becoming embroiled in the fighting over Darwin. After things quieted down there, they ended up moving over to Brisbane, where they had a quiet period of daily patrolling to bring in replacements and get them trained up. But they got word at the end of April that they’d be moving soon, and immediately after the Battle of Coral Sea they packed up and shipped out, heading up to Port Moresby on New Guinea, making Kila Kila Airfield, AKA “3 Mile Drome,” their new home on 11 May 1942. They only had a couple days before they were called to action.

On 13 May, Captain Cotton led six P-40s against four Zeros and six Bettys.  One Zero and one Betty were downed at the cost of three P-40s and 25/30 damage points on the New Guinea Harbor Facilities.

Now, Captain Goode is leading a depleted flight of only four P-40s up against four Zeros and six Bettys.

The US interceptor group, from top:

2nd Lt Lageman, a Rookie on his first combat mission
Captain Goode, an Ace with five kills on two sorties
2nd Lt Becht, a Regular with one kill, on his second ever mission
2nd Lt O’Brien, a Regular with no kills, on his second mission, too

Wow, what a pisser!  Talk about bad rolls; I’ve broken the fighters into pairs, then roll to see which pairs are in the fight, rolling for three pairs.  Well, two of the ‘pairs’ I rolled up fought yesterday, with the Rookie becoming a Regular, but each having lost his more experienced partner, so I’m down two fighters, and the ones I have are less experienced.

Things are not looking good for Captain Goode, as a Japanese ‘Natural Born Killer’ swoops in on his starboard side and a Japanese ‘Ace’ swoops in on his port side.

It’s a full on melee as Lt Lageman, looking for revenge, lines up a perfect no deflection shot on the Japanese NBK.

To see how the fight went, please check the blog at:
https://oldleadbreed.blogspot.com/2019/10/chickenhawks-over-new-guinea-2.html

More to come!

V/R,
Jack

[kyoteblue]

That was just so bad for the Chickenhawks that I dread the next fight.

[Deleted User]

Green (Zero) 01 for the win!

Maybe for the next fight they should zoon in on the bombers and avoid any dog fight?

[kyoteblue]

Maybe for the next fight, they should zoon in on the bombers and avoid any dog fight?

I’ve said the same thing but I think for Jack the dog fights are what he wants to do and the bombers are just window dressing.

[Deleted User]

He’s burning through his squadrons. Even as a staunched IJN supporter I’m feeling the pain of losing perfectly good aircraft.
Mission objectives man! Mission objectives!

[Just Jack]

Good grief, Frick and Frack are killing me with the post-game strategizing 😉

No, the bombers are not window dressing; yes, they are the objective of the interceptors, but you must remember that the bombers are also the objective of the escorts, so, the enemy gets a say in what happens.  The turn sequence is 1) escorts move, 2) interceptors move, then 3) bombers move, rinse and repeat.  The only way to do what you’re saying is 1) push ahead madly, 2) let the interceptors take a front aspect pass at you and hope you don’t get shot down, 3) push past the escorts, 4) hope the escorts aren’t able (because of their high preponderance of NBKs, Aces, and Veterans) to immediately whip around onto your tail before you even reach the bombers, 5) ignore the enemy fighters behind you and charge in on the bombers, 6) make one frontal aspect pass on the enemy bombers, hoping you destroy or damage and force a couple to return to base, 7) get shot down by the Japanese fighters, which most assuredly would have caught up to you by now.

Now, in a bog-standard game there’s only four escorts to your six interceptors, so the chances are the escorts won’t be able to shoot down all six of your interceptors (unless they got lucky on the first run through and downed an interceptor or tw0 before you got to the bombers), so one or two of them might be able to make their run on the enemy bombers, then disengage by diving away to safety and letting the remaining bombers (probably four or five of them) continue through to pound their targets.

I get that that is pretty much how real life was going (when enemy Zeros were around), but that’s not very fun, and especially not very heroic.  I’ll do it at some point, just to show you what it looks like.  From that standpoint, it’s really not a game, it’s just a dice off.  It could just as easily be converted to this:
1) roll 1D6 per escort, killing an interceptor on 5+
2) roll 1D 6 per interceptor, killing a bomber on 5+
3) Roll 1D6 per 1.5 escorts (to throw some stuff in the game about maybe one of the escorts not being able to get into position), killing an interceptor on 4+
Any escort that survived that is assumed to have dove to safety and waited out the bombing raid after having made his pass on the Japanese bombers.

Not really my idea of fun.  If that’s not what you guys are getting at, please let me know, but it seems like you think the escorts can just go after the bombers and the escorts are going to screw off and have a smoke while the action is going down.

V/R,
Jack

[kyoteblue]

The P-40’s should get as high as the can then dive on the bombers shoot and dive away from the Zero’s not try to dogfight them.  That is historical but wouldn’t make a fun game, shrug.

[Deleted User]

I get it wouldn’t be fun but considering the situation maybe survival is the better option. Could always dogfight after they’ve made a pass at the bombers. I was thinking they’d zoom passed the zeros who would have to turn around to follow them but I forgot movement is rolled randomly so that probably wouldn’t work too well.
All the things that helped in real life to win against Zeros can’t be done with the rules or wasn’t fun or heroic.

It’s weird I feel like you’re the IJN loosing experience pilots in South pacific.

Forgot to mention, I’m coming up on 40. Seeing P-40s getting shot down like a bucket of popcorn when you fell down the stairs at the cinema watching Titanic for the 13th time after a being sttod up by your date reminds me of my own mortality and question the meaning life, democratcy and wargaming.

[kyoteblue]

My baby twins turn 40 in Dec!!! Damn, I’m old !!!

[Just Jack]

Okay, well, good, I’m glad you two at least agree with me on the idea that the realistic concept wouldn’t be much fun, we’re making progress 😉
From a ‘survival’ stand point, I’m actually not that worried about it.  In the overall scheme of things, my squadrons have actually done better than I was could have hoped, as I expect them largely to perform as the war went.  Remember, it’s only May 1942, and the Allies have known nothing but utter defeat in the Pacific up to this point, except for the Battle of the Coral Sea, which was widely applauded as a victory but, in tactical terms could only be considered a defeat (losing lots of aircraft and a fleet carrier to lots of aircraft and a light carrier), and in strategic/operational terms a draw (blunting the Japanese amphibious landing at Port Moresby for the cost of one of its six carriers in the whole world, when the Japanese had eight, I think).

So you might be worried about my squadrons surviving but I’m not.  They’re taking their lumps, just like the Allies did at Hong Kong, Singapore, Pearl Harbor, the Philippines, Wake, Guam, DEI, Malaya, etc…), but a time will come, when the odds will even, then tilt in their favor.  This New Guinea campaign is going to be rough, probably going to do two seven-fight operations with P-40s, and Midway will be the about the same for the USN as Coral Sea was.  Things will look up a bit for my Marines at Guadalcanal when the Japanese will be penalized a bit (as they were in real life, hamstrung by pushing their Zeros all the way from Rabaul), and then life is really going to change when the Hellcats, P-38s, and Corsairs hit the fleet.  I’m in this for the long haul 😉

It’s a bit strange that you’ve seen Titanic 13 times, by yourself, especially given the fact your under 40.  I worked for a Gunny for awhile who’s favorite thing in the whole world was to come up behind me and do that whiny “Jack, Jack” in Rose’s freezing voice.

And I feel ya, lately I’ve been questioning the meaning of democratcy lately, too 😉  And you’re too old to be trying to run six-minute miles, your body doesn’t recover well enough and you’re just pounding your ankles, knees and lower back at this point.  It’s not that you couldn’t do it, just that the long term damage and chance of injury owing to the extensive training you (likely) have to do, it’s probably not worth it. Sorry, but ’round here I’m known as the cold voice of reality 😉

Yes, John, everyone knows you’re an old bastid 😉

V/R,
Jack

[kyoteblue]

You damn kids!!!!

[Whirlwind]

Ouch! That hurt…pity the rookie missed his chance…

[Deleted User]

Not worried about your squadrons surviving at all, more food for IJN pilots, just don’t like seeing good planes wasted :p
I’m dreading the day you start the Marianna fights.

The whole Titanic comment was for comedic effect, I’ve only seen it on TV. You’ll never catch me in a cinema for something like that I need to keep my testoosterone I have for the mile run 😀
You’re right about the recovery time. Trying to keep up with 24 year olds wasn’t a good idea, took me 2 weeks to recover but those guys were back up after a few days. And that was 10 years ago.

[Just Jack]

Whirlwind – Yeah man, some of these butt-whoopings are just down to pure bad luck, guys missing their shots when they get them.

Thomaston – Yep, all this will come back around.  Just gotta make it ’til then…

And don’t try and pull it back now; you’re a wargamer, a bit socially awkward, floated the Titanic stuff figuring everyone loves it as much as you do, and when it goes sideways you pull the whole ‘I don’t like Titanic, you like Titanic!’ tactic.  Put another way, I figured you were joking 😉

Yeah man, recovery time and stress injuries are a killer post-30.  Good luck, I suppose.  I’d rather you were gaming than running, but go ahead, selfishly put your health before sharing your talents with the world 😉

V/R,
Jack

[Just Jack]

All,

1130 local time
16 May 1942
New Guinea

Greetings all, having just wrapped up the Coral Sea battles, I figured it’s time to head back to my U.S. Army Air Corps fighter squadron, the 565th Tactical Fighter Squadron, better known as the “Chickenhawks.” The last we saw of the Chickenhawks was back in February of 1942; they’d started out fighting the Japanese over the Dutch East Indies before falling back to Australia and becoming embroiled in the fighting over Darwin. After things quieted down there, they ended up moving over to Brisbane, where they had a quiet period of daily patrolling to bring in replacements and get them trained up. But they got word at the end of April that they’d be moving soon, and immediately after the Battle of Coral Sea they packed up and shipped out, heading up to Port Moresby on New Guinea, making Kila Kila Airfield, AKA “3 Mile Drome,” their new home on 11 May 1942. They only had a couple days before they were called to action.

On 13 May, Captain Cotton led six P-40s against four Zeros and six Bettys. One Zero and one Betty were downed at the cost of three P-40s and 25/30 damage points on the New Guinea Harbor Facilities.

On 14 May, Captain Goode led a depleted flight of only four P-40s up against four Zeros and six Bettys, and it was an unmitigated disaster.  All four US fighters were shot down, with Captain Goode and Lt O’Brien killed in action, while the enemy didn’t lose a single aircraft!  The Japanese bombers quickly finished off the Harbor Facilities, and pounded the Marshalling Area (22/30 damage points).

Now, it’s 16 May. The weather was bad yesterday so the Chickenhawks had a bit of a reprieve, but this morning the skies were clear and the Japanese were at it again, filling the skies with twin-engine bombers.  Major Jordan, the Squadron Leader, leads six P-40s aloft to face six Bettys escorted by four Zeros.

This is my arena for aerial combat; simple, yet durable and, to me, beautiful (in a simple, durable way). I’m using tiny aircraft designed by my buddy Thomaston; not sure what size they are, just that they are much smaller than 1/600. They’re 3D printed models that I mounted on cut-down bases from Litko, and I’m using a very simple rules system called “Battle of Britain,” which I found for free over on The Miniatures Page (I’ve already played a good 20 or so fights with them). Left is north, with the Japanese strike group there, and the American interceptors at right.

The US Army Air Corps pilots are being much more aggressive in this fight.

And the foxes get in amongst the chickens quick.

Gotta tip the hat to Thomaston and Kyote, not 100%, but a bit more focus on getting to the bombers, along with a little luck with the shootin’ dice, paid off.

And it’s a straight up melee in the sky, with one of the Chickenhawks winning the Distinguished Flying Cross!

To see how the fight went, please check the blog at:
https://oldleadbreed.blogspot.com/2019/11/chickenhawks-over-new-guinea-3.html

The Americans, feeling their oats, have something a bit more offensive in mind.  Coming right up.

V/R,
Jack

[Deleted User]

That went pretty well until Zero 01 got shot down.
Why did the bombers turn back? Was it a roll or was it part of the historical event?

My prediction, next fight Daniel will get shot down.

[kyoteblue]

Damn !!!! We won!!!!

[Author]

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