Home Forums Modern Dinassaut!

Viewing 24 posts - 1 through 24 (of 24 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #143142
    Avatar photoJim Jackaman
    Participant

    Here’s my latest idea for squeezing some extra mileage out of my modular river terrain.

    http://jimswargamesworkbench.blogspot.com/2020/08/dinassaut.html

    I was thinking of Fivecore Company Command for this but would be really interested in any other ideas for rules.

    Cheers

    Jim

    #143143
    Avatar photoJim Jackaman
    Participant

    If you don’t know what this is all about, check out this excellent overview:

    http://indochine54.free.fr/cefeo/dinassau.html

    #143159
    Avatar photoJim Jackaman
    Participant

    Good video clip here too:

    https://www.britishpathe.com/video/french-commandos-round-up-rebels/query/IndoChina+war+amphibious

    Lots of potential for ambushes, sweeps, support operations, amphibious assaults etc.

    I was wondering if BKC or CWC would handle this well?

    #143240
    Avatar photoNathaniel Weber
    Participant

    Very cool! I guess its the blend of naval and land combat that I like so much about riverine warfare.

    I touched on this force in my dissertation (about US advisors during the Cold War—Vietnam/INdochina being one of the chapters). The American MAAG advisors, who overall had highly mixed thoughts about France’s expeditionary forces in Vietnam, thought very highly of the riverine forces (who I think the French called “Khaki Navy,” as opposed to the American habit of Brown Water Navy).

    #143246
    Avatar photoJim Jackaman
    Participant

    Exactly, with hidden movement for the Vietminh, so that the CEFEO forces have to find them, get ambushed etc.

    Not sure which way to go with rules though, perhaps some simple microscale WW2 rules that I could adapt or a set of Vietnam rules with amphibious landings, air support, search and destroy etc included.

    The idea would be to run company level scenarios with squad basing and 1:1 for the vehicles.

    I think it would be great as a participation game?

     

    #143247
    Avatar photoPrince Rhys
    Participant

    I really like your ideas, and I had no idea about the French Indochina river war. I’ve only really read about the lead up to, and what happened at, Dien Bien Phu.

    #143249
    Avatar photoJim Jackaman
    Participant

    Apparently Paddy Griffith wrote a set of rules for riverine actions in Vietnam called Mouth of the Dragon?

    Anyone know anything about them?

    I think I have a copy of Buckle for your Dust which includes them, so I’ll have to dig it out.

    #143255
    Avatar photoPrince Rhys
    Participant
    #143256
    Avatar photoJim Jackaman
    Participant

    I really like your ideas, and I had no idea about the French Indochina river war. I’ve only really read about the lead up to, and what happened at, Dien Bien Phu.

    There’s a lot more to it than that. It’s a fascinating conflict with all sorts of potential.

    #143303
    Avatar photoJim Jackaman
    Participant

    Just found my copy of Buckle for your Dust including the riverine warfare rules by Paddy Griffith – Mouth of the Dragon.

    At first skim through (there’s only six pages) they look very promising…just have to swap out helicopters for fixed wing air support and work out the French equivalents for the various landing craft, monitors, gunboats etc.

    ….this might actually work!

    #143304
    Avatar photoJim Jackaman
    Participant
    #143309
    Avatar photoEtranger
    Participant

    Just found my copy of Buckle for your Dust including the riverine warfare rules by Paddy Griffith – Mouth of the Dragon. At first skim through (there’s only six pages) they look very promising…just have to swap out helicopters for fixed wing air support and work out the French equivalents for the various landing craft, monitors, gunboats etc. ….this might actually work!

    A lot of the US riverine craft followed on from their French equivalents. Some actually were veterans of the French war. A lot of the French stuff was actually of WII origin, LCM’s, LCVP’s. LCA’s and the like all featured. Their monitors were LCMs with the turret from a Coventry Armoured Car on the forward section of the (covered) hold. Most of the conversion work was done in in the field. My Dinassaut features modified LCMs and LCAs, & there are some LCVP in the stash somewhere.

    If you haven’t seen it, this is Croziat’s original report on the French Indochina war – he went on to write extensively on the riverine war. https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_memoranda/RM5271.html My books alas are all packed away.

    #143312
    Avatar photoDarkest Star Games
    Participant

    Super rad!  You’ll have to post this to the Fields of Fire forum as well, there are more than a couple of Indochina enthusiast over there:

    https://fieldsoffire.forumotion.com/f4-la-guerre-d-indochine

    "I saw this in a cartoon once, but I'm pretty sure I can do it..."

    #143313
    Avatar photoEtranger
    Participant

    Oh, and if you’re looking at 15mm, then Gomi Designs, (a sponsor of this site) have US riverine craft, some of which might be able to stand in for their French predescessors. https://gomidesigns.co.uk/Vietnam

    #143327
    Avatar photoJim Jackaman
    Participant
    #143328
    Avatar photoJim Jackaman
    Participant

    I’ve been thinking of doing this for quite a long time so have gradually gathered together some useful background stuff.

    This book is particularly useful:

    #143329
    Avatar photoJim Jackaman
    Participant

    Oh, and if you’re looking at 15mm, then Gomi Designs, (a sponsor of this site) have US riverine craft, some of which might be able to stand in for their French predescessors. https://gomidesigns.co.uk/Vietnam

    I had originally planned a 15mm platoon level project using the Eureka figures and vehicles from QRF etc but it didn’t get off the ground.

    I think 1/600th has a lot more to offer for this.

    #143330
    Avatar photoJim Jackaman
    Participant

    A lot of the US riverine craft followed on from their French equivalents. Some actually were veterans of the French war. A lot of the French stuff was actually of WII origin, LCM’s, LCVP’s. LCA’s and the like all featured. Their monitors were LCMs with the turret from a Coventry Armoured Car on the forward section of the (covered) hold. Most of the conversion work was done in in the field. My Dinassaut features modified LCMs and LCAs, & there are some LCVP in the stash somewhere. If you haven’t seen it, this is Croziat’s original report on the French Indochina war – he went on to write extensively on the riverine war. https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_memoranda/RM5271.html My books alas are all packed away.[/quote]

    Great link. Thanks

    #143335
    Avatar photoJim Jackaman
    Participant

    Oh, and if you’re looking at 15mm, then Gomi Designs, (a sponsor of this site) have US riverine craft, some of which might be able to stand in for their French predescessors. https://gomidesigns.co.uk/Vietnam

    You have got me thinking now about the 15mm skirmish option again!

    http://jimswargamesworkbench.blogspot.com/2018/01/15mm-french-indochina-war-landing-craft.html

    #143353
    Avatar photoEtranger
    Participant

    Oh, and if you’re looking at 15mm, then Gomi Designs, (a sponsor of this site) have US riverine craft, some of which might be able to stand in for their French predescessors. https://gomidesigns.co.uk/Vietnam

    I had originally planned a 15mm platoon level project using the Eureka figures and vehicles from QRF etc but it didn’t get off the ground.

    I think 1/600th has a lot more to offer for this.

    That’s the way I went in 15mm.

    If 1/300 is an option then GHQ have an American Riverine range in 1/300 & there’s a decent selection of WWII landing craft from Heroics & Ros and from Scotia Grendel. Warlord do separate weapons sprues for the Cruel Seas models to allow kitting out of modified LC, & also a Fairmile, although it’s the long ‘Dog boat’ rather than the Fairmile B used as a HDML which turned up in Indochina.

    #143360
    Avatar photoDarkest Star Games
    Participant

    I’ve done a lot of VN riverine in 1/600 and it’s a great scale to use.  Realistic ranges and movement, as well as river widths, rally and assembly areas, choke points and danger areas.  Lots of room to fly helos around (or in your case Bearcats and Invaders).  You can get a real sense of the dimension of the battle and a much more complete operation.

    But the great thing about having both 15mm and 1/600 is you can zoom in on specific actions in skirmish scale and have them effect the overall operation.  I’ve been doing with the next level up for FNG, using 3 skirmish turns for a 1/600 turn.  Adds a lot of time and takes some room of course, but it really gives a much bigger punch to my gaming satisfaction.

    "I saw this in a cartoon once, but I'm pretty sure I can do it..."

    #146598
    Avatar photoRisaldar Singh
    Participant

    Very nice. As you say, Mouth of the Dragon really only needs minimal changes. The Romeo boats and earlier LCMs have pretty much the same firepower, the monitors are similar with a turret gun that is more focused on bunker penetration than volume of fire, it’s mostly the ASPBs that need replacing with much slower and less capable EAs/LVTPs. The main difference, of course, is, as shown in your pics, the use of much bigger LCIs in the Dinassaut and LCTs on bigger ops.

    What size are your river tiles? I need to build some myself and I’ll be caging all the good ideas out there. 😉

    #146603
    Avatar photoJim Jackaman
    Participant

    They’re 30cm x 30cm give or take. I used mdf sign boards from Poundland that I bought in a sale for 25p each as the base. The terrain is cut from cork tiles.

    #146608
    Avatar photoDarkest Star Games
    Participant

    It occurs to me that GHQ have a set of 6mm Vietnam rules including riverine rules:

    The Vietnam War – Supplement to Micro Armour®: The Game – Modern

    Never taken a look at them, but the blurb seems to show them being pretty complete.  Shouldn’t be difficult to convert stats if they don’t have them.

    "I saw this in a cartoon once, but I'm pretty sure I can do it..."

Viewing 24 posts - 1 through 24 (of 24 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.