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  • This topic has 55 replies, 23 voices, and was last updated 6 months ago by Mike.
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  • #148540
    Kitfox
    Participant

    I’ll keep it short then: not really our target audience… The idea that one should be an audience, indeed a target audience, has no appeal to me. Sorry, but there you go. I’m interested in war, I’m interested in history, I’m interested in the history of war but sadly I’m not particularly interested in the egotistical ramblings of wargame designers or opinions of anyone. Opinions are invariably wrong and they carry weight not on their intrinsic merit but on the popularity of those who hold them.

    You’re a real ray of sunshine.  Why bother posting at all?

    Death to all fanatics!

    #148541
    Mike
    Keymaster

    Opinions are invariably wrong

    Well, that is your opinion.

    😉

    #148542
    Mike
    Keymaster

    Seriously though, the idea behind TWW is to create and foster a place of positivity.
    It is about the sharing of ideas and to discuss what we like, not to bash that which we don’t.

    Hopefully we can move on?

    #148543
    kevin halloran
    Participant

    By the way, when I appear critical of wargame designers I don’t exempt myself.  I was the designer of the first ever wargames programme on UK TV, Channel 4’s Game of War, which was presented by Angela Rippon and fronted by my old friend Paddy Griffith and Ian Dickie.  It was short lived and I knew we were doomed when the producer – a very nice lady whose name escapes me – said to me; “It’s very masculine, Kevin; are there not any wars where the generals were women?”

    #148544
    kevin halloran
    Participant

    Mike, cheers.  I will move on.  I seem already to be a disruptive influence so shall withdraw.  Funny though that you object to people bashing what they don’t like when surely that’s what happened here to me.  Anyway, good luck but I’m not really interested in having to be one of the boys.

    #148547
    Guy Farrish
    Participant

    That’s a shame Kevin.

    I don’t think Michael meant you to ‘move on’ as in away. He meant us all to ‘move on’ to other topics.

    I was a friend of Paddy too, and I occasionally still see Iain Dickie, and hope to again soon, post Covid. I really enjoyed the series and still have a couple of the episodes on VHS! Many thanks for your part in that.

    Paddy certainly had opinions; informed, well constructed, evidence based opinions. History isn’t simply facts, it’s interpretation of sources though the skill and background knowledge of the historian. Admittedly having to drill down through  layers of other interpretations is galling when you want the facts so can produce your own interpretation – no doubt this is a particular pain in your field of early mediaeval studies  where evidence is scarce and opinion abundant.

    Opinion can be very useful however as a background touchstone for the researcher/analyst – if the wargame designer from wherever has a particular view of certain aspects of combat from his early studies it may explain why I like/dislike certain mechanisms or approaches and can help me decide whether to buy, emulate, steal or ignore parts of his work.

    Anyway, please don’t just leave. It would be sad to lose you so soon.

    My (informed) opinion.

    #148548
    Mike
    Keymaster

    He meant us all to ‘move on’ to other topics.

    Yup.

    #148549
    Guy Farrish
    Participant

    One other thing – much as I loved (and still enjoy) watching Paddy, Iain and Arthur Harman umpiring the various generals and journalists in Game of War, it wasn’t the first TV wargame.

    Paddy himself took part in a Tyne Tees series much earlier, with Edward Woodward the host and commentator with Peter Gilder amongst other playing various games – Battleground? – in the late 70s.

    #148565
    Phil Dutré
    Participant

    Opinions are invariably wrong and they carry weight not on their intrinsic merit but on the popularity of those who hold them.

    An opinion is an opinion precisely because it cannot always be proven by hard facts, but an opinion is rather a viewpoint or choice. Not right or wrong, but … opinion 😉

    E.g. you can have an opinion about whether D10s or D6s are better for wargames. Or whether Napoleon should have done this or that at Waterloo. But you cannot have an opinion on the average value of a die roll, or on whether the French army was beaten at Waterloo. YMMV.

    Tiny Tin Men Blog: http://snv-ttm.blogspot.com/
    Wargaming Mechanics Blog: http://wargaming-mechanics.blogspot.com/

    #148566
    Phil Dutré
    Participant

    I have never read a wargaming magazine… I only ever read the first couple of sentences of any email or forum post

    I’ll keep it short then: not really our target audience…

    🙂

    There’s always something useful in every wargaming magazine. Even if it’s not a scenario or ruleset that you can use immediately, there’s always the photographs, the news, the reviews, … to keep the mojo going.

    And yes, I admit that sometimes there’s a sometimes a run of issues that interest me somewhat less, but then the next couple of issues are excellent again. Magazines should be judged over the run of a year or years, not issue by issue. Same as your favorite football team 😉

    Tiny Tin Men Blog: http://snv-ttm.blogspot.com/
    Wargaming Mechanics Blog: http://wargaming-mechanics.blogspot.com/

    #148567
    General Slade
    Participant

    But you cannot have an opinion on the average value of a die roll, or on whether the French army was beaten at Waterloo. YMMV.

    You want to try saying that on a certain other website.  I think you will find that the French army wasn’t beaten.  It retired in good order and Napoleon would have led them to victory if it hadn’t been for incompetents like Grouchy and Ney.  And anyway the British cheated by paying other people to fight their battles for them.  And it shouldn’t be called Waterloo – it should be called the Battle of La Belle Alliance, which Blucher suggested.  But then he was pregnant by an elephant at the time so what does he know?

    And any wargamer will tell you that averages are irrelevant because the dice are always against you.

    Or something like that.

    #148578
    Mike Headden
    Participant

    Daub Errata

    Paint placidly amid the noise and haste, and make the most of whatever passes for silence.

    As far as possible without surrender be on good terms with spouses, parents, pets and children.

    Pass on tips quietly and clearly; and listen to others, even the dull and the ignorant; they too have their insights.

    Avoid power gamers, they are vexations to the spirit.

    If you compare yourself with others, you may become vain and bitter; for always there will be greater and lesser painters than yourself.

    Enjoy your achievements as well as your plans.

    Keep interested in your own armies, however humble; they are a real possession in the changing fortunes of time.

    Exercise caution on EBay; for it is full of trickery. But let this not blind you to what virtue there is; many persons strike surprising deals; and everywhere there are bargains.

    Be yourself. Everyone else is taken!

    Especially, do not feign an interest. Neither be cynical about production schedules; for in the face of all aridity and disenchantment sooner or later someone will make a model of it in a scale you want.

    Take kindly the counsel of the years, gracefully surrendering the things of youth; eyesight, steady hands ….

    Nurture strength of spirit to shield you in sudden misfortune. But do not distress yourself with dark imaginings. Many botched paint jobs are born of fatigue and loneliness. Beyond a wholesome discipline, be gentle with yourself.

    You are a child of this forum, no less than Mike, Guy or Deephorse*; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt your favourite figure ranges are unfolding as they should. Therefore be at peace with the forum, whatever you conceive it to be, and whatever your labours and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life, keep pace with your purchases.

    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world.

    Be cheerful.

    Strive to paint something.

    <Sorry Max>

     

    *Other forum users are available 🙂

    M. Headden 2017

    Growing old is mandatory, growing up is entirely optional!

    #148580
    deephorse
    Participant

    🙂 There’s always something useful in every wargaming magazine.

     

    I wouldn’t go quite that far.  I’ve bought MW and WI for more years than I care to remember.  Covid put a stop to that though.  A newsagent in my home town put aside these magazines for me, and I would collect them every month.  I couldn’t travel during the first lockdown, but knew that the magazines would be waiting for me when next I could go.

    How wrong can you be?  During lockdown my newsagent changed ownership and when I finally managed to visit I discovered that they had no idea who I was and they had no magazines for me.  This caused me to reflect upon the value of these magazines to me, and I came to the conclusion that this value was essentially nil.  There had been no content of interest to me for months.  The fault here though lies with me.  My wargaming interests are very narrow, and based on rules and games that are no longer at the cutting edge.

    Ironically, having decided to ditch the mags, MW goes and publishes a single page in #453 that is of interest, so I bought that issue.  Spending £5.99 for a single page of text is not an expense that I can justify month in, month out, so this will be a one-off I’m afraid.  Sorry John.

    Less enthusiasm, please. This is Britain.

    #148582
    John Treadaway
    Participant

    No sweat Dark Horse. I do have some news of possible interest, though:

    What we have coming out in the next issue is an announcement of a new deal for digital back copies running back ten years for as little as £2 a copy on a “your’s to keep” deal: watch out for that one!

    John Treadaway

    www.hammers-slammers.com
    http://www.hammers-slammers.com

    "They don't have to like us, snake, they just have t' make the payment schedule" Lt Cooter - Hammer's Slammers
    #148632

    Seriously though, the idea behind TWW is to create and foster a place of positivity. It is about the sharing of ideas and to discuss what we like, not to bash that which we don’t. Hopefully we can move on?

    Well, a positive answer to express a dislike might be, “Wargames magazines are really not my thing.  Good luck with the article though!”

    I mean seriously.  I left a certain other website that I’d been supporting for about 15 years because attitudes were just getting ridiculous.  I came here because folks are generally quite nice!

    Anyway, I do read Miniature Wargames.  I find usually 1 quarter to 1 half of the articles have at least some interest to me.  I usually read through the whole thing whether I am directly interested or not.  I am looking forward to your article, Mike.

    John

     

    John

    "Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power."

    --Abraham Lincoln

    #148637
    Mike
    Keymaster

    I am looking forward to your article, Mike.

    Thanks though it is not the one I wanted to write due to the word limit and it is most likely it is preaching to the choir..

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