Recommend Me A Small-Unit Sci Fi Game

[Mr. Average]

What I’m looking for but not finding a lot of:

• infantry in stands, fireteam or squad size, but with weapons that are non-trivial (that is, NOT “all guns are the same, one number covers all.”)
• tanks and vehicles are individual, and also non-trivial
• air and artillery assets are available
• range of sci fi types: grav tanks, hovers, wheeled, tracked
• design rules
• different types of force should feel different in play, i.e., high-speed grav armor should require different tactics from an all-infantry Power Armor company holding an objective.

Something tells me I’m describing Horizon Wars but I’m not familiar with it or its antecedents so I can’t quite tell. Others I’ve found in the department are Tomorrow’s War (a mess of a rule book but I sense a good game in it), Striker/Striker II (complex to play but seems rewarding if I could master it), Dirtside (the standby, but groups vehicles into platoons in a way that puts command a bit higher up than I have in mind, and also nerfs any infantry that doesn’t have special weapons), Strike Legion (super flexible but a hot mess of interlocking rules, and again with the platoons of tanks that must all be the same).

Any others come to mind, o TWW group-think?

[Mike]

One of the Nordic Weasel  Games?

[Northern Monkey]

Gruntz does everything on your list of requirements

My attempt at a Blog: http://ablogofwar.blogspot.co.uk/

[Ivan Sorensen]

I can do you most of those with LaserStorm.

It’s aimed at 6mm, though at least one guy plays in 15,

Basing is the same (intentionally) as the old Space Marine, so 5 man squads or single vehicles.

The aim is to have a lot of toys on the table with no markers, counters or other tracking.

Air assets are abstracted through off-board resources though.

Combat is “old fashioned”: Roll to hit by weapon system, take saving throws. As units fail morale checks, they are taken off the table and can be brought back when rallied to reinforce a flank, back up an assault or that kind of stuff.
Full unit builders and campaign rules of course 🙂

Of the ones you list, its closest to Dirtside as far as game scale, though it can go far bigger.

http://www.wargamevault.com/product/157157/LaserStorm-6mm-grand-warfare

[Mr. Average]

Ah, Gruntz. Ill have to give it a look, don’t know why it didn’t occur to me. I will say though, that good GOD those Z’s stopped being clever SO fast. Everything with a Z. Oy vey.

Laserstorm is higher level tha. I’m looking for, more like a large company-to-battalion size while I’m looking for smaller stuff. Not skirmish, but one small step up from there.

[Ruarigh]

I second Gruntz. It’s a great game with a lot of flexibility.

You might also find that the Critical Mass rules fit the bill. They are designed for figures based on stands and a range of weapons and stats. The rules only include lists for the four forces that Critical Mass produces, but there is a free download from CM explaining how to design your own forces.

I quite like Striker II but also consider it a missed opportunity. There’s really too much detail in the design, even though I love the Command Decision engine.

Tomorrow’s War makes my head ache. The game plays quite well, but it just feels like so much hard work. The rules writers almost seem to assume that you already have and play their modern rules, and answers to questions on the forum often reference Force on Force. For £25 I expect better from a rules book.

Never argue with an idiot. They'll only drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

https://roderickdale.co.uk/
https://emidsvikings.ac.uk/

[Stroezie]

Got a chance to try out the critical mass rules at crisis a few years back, they are solid, played a lot like flames of war but with unit activation instead of whole armies at a time.
The design your own forces pdf works reasonably well but can be abused. But that is true for most if not all build your own forces rules imo.

[Mr. Average]

Looks like Grunts(Z) is pretty close to what I’m looking for here. Am studying the rules closely…

Will have to to look at Critical Mass – I’ve long admired their miniatures, even if they are way too big for me.

[Ruarigh]

I look forward to reading your game reports, and please post what you think of Critical Mass Rules if you try them. I have a copy but have never yet managed to get a game in. I’ve been considering getting a Praesentia force for ages, because it would be very different from anything else I have.

Never argue with an idiot. They'll only drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

https://roderickdale.co.uk/
https://emidsvikings.ac.uk/

[Steve Johnson]

We tried Gruntz but they just didn’t work for us.

[Angel Barracks]

Steve Johnson wrote:

We tried Gruntz but they just didn’t work for us.

 

Oh yeah, I remember you saying that, what was it again that put you off?

[Northern Monkey]

Gruntz isn’t perfect (what is?) but the core system, ie shooting, movement, assault etc is sound, the rulebook itself is poorly edited with rules and modifiers dotted here and there, and the point system only really works for low to average stat lines once you get into the elite level of stats it can easily create an unbalanced game, and some of the perks are ridiculously cheap(points-wise), saying all that I really like the rules, I like a skirmish rule set where each trooper in the squad can do their own thing, 1 goes prone, another goes into overwatch 2 more let off shots whilst 2 others dash for cover, Gruntz lets me do this without bogging the game down in too much detail

My attempt at a Blog: http://ablogofwar.blogspot.co.uk/

[Ivan Sorensen]

I had seen someone do a modified Gruntz points formula with multipliers applied to high stat/perk combinations but I can’t remember where I saw it.

Essentially, taking two or more good things would end up being more expensive than simply the scores added together, if that makes sense.

[Steve Johnson]

“Oh yeah, I remember you saying that, what was it again that put you off?”

Well the thing that really got us was that we has both used the online unit builder programme, and yet similar units were wildly different in games terms. This really unbalanced things as Craig’s units pretty much walked around the table, whilst I was unable to do much to affect them, yet they were alomost identical troops!!! Add in the fact that we couldn’t find things in the rulebook when we needed to, plus the game taking ages to play with no end in sight in terms of a victory for either side.

Shame really as they promised so much, but for us, delivered so little. I still prefer KR-16 for my skirmish games as they provide a fun game that can be finished in an evening.

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