Tinywargames.

[Not Connard Sage]

Obviously some of you will have bought battlemats from them, but has anyone had any issues?

I’ve just been reading their T&Cs, some of which appear to contradict UK laws on distant selling. Before I spank the plastic, I’d like to be sure that if it goes tits up I’m not having the hassle of claiming a Section 75.

Ta, and compliments of the season to you all 🙂

 

 

Obvious contrarian and passive aggressive old prat, who is taken far too seriously by some and not seriously enough by others.

[bobm]

Unfortunately a fair few UK wargame companies seem to flout distance selling regs.  Postal address missing…sometimes, adding VAT to retail prices …sometimes, refusing returns if not satisfied…sometimes

There's 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary and those who don't.....

[Mike]

Aren’t retail prices in the UK required to include VAT?
Non retail prices such as items in a plumbers merchant can be priced without VAT, but retail shops need to include the VAT?

[Mr. Average]

I couldn’t say for sure, but I live in the USA and have had fine relations with Tinywargames.  Nice product.  I prefer Cigar Box Battles mats as they tend to have a less stiff material so I can lay my terrain under for a “rolling” effect. But the print quality on the TWG product is excellent and never had any issues with delivery to my overseas Secure, Undisclosed Location.

I’ll add that the USA isn’t a VAT country, we have Sales Tax, and that’s not federally levied, it’s one of the sovereign powers of the individual states.  So we’re all liable for sales tax on things we buy from overseas in a percentage set by the state of which we’re citizens, but typically not for VAT, unless it’s on a good or service we would be keeping in or using in the country of origin.  If I bought a mat from TWG which I had sent to an address in the UK with intent to use it there, I would pay VAT on it.  Having it sent to the USA, I don’t pay VAT but I do pay Sales Tax set by my state.  But that’s not uniformly collected and overseas purchases (in my state) of less than $600 value are generally not required to be reported.

[Blackhat]

I have bought a couple of mats from them and they are okay – not as nice as the Deep Cut Studio mats but they are fine for the money.  You get no communication from them about your order though – it just eventually turns up…

I have seen reports of some problsm with custom orders and I know someone who had to try twice before getting the right mat.

Mike

[deephorse]

At the Stockton show in November (IIRC) 2018 I ordered a mat at their stand.  The selling point for me was that they could print it to your exact requirements.  10cm hexes on a WWI trench mat and 10′ x 8′ in size.  Of course dealing in person meant that I wasn’t aware of any website issues.  However, I was handing over about £100 (again, IIRC) to a company I knew nothing about.  The mat did turn up and I am happy with it.  If they are still in business two years later they are probably doing something right.

Play is what makes life bearable - Michael Rosen

[Jemima Fawr]

Yes, as has been said, the product is good and they can do it to your exact requirements.  I wanted a 8′ x 6′ mat and they were the only company I could find in the UK or EU who could do that for me.  However, as has been said, their website does break Distance Selling Regs (as do many others in the hobby) and I have seen forum posts criticising their speed of delivery, but I had absolutely no problems whatsoever (about two years ago).

My wargames blog: http://www.jemimafawr.co.uk/

[DCRBrown]

I would stay with their standard sizes; I ordered a bespoke size which they were ultimately unable to fulfil.

DB

[Not Connard Sage]

What I was wanting was a 4×4 mat for 2mm DBN, and another for HotT

Now I’m conflicted 🙁

Obvious contrarian and passive aggressive old prat, who is taken far too seriously by some and not seriously enough by others.

[Alexander Hay-Whitton]

I bought a custom-sized (four foot by eight) double-sided mat in mousepad rubber from them about a year ago. I was very satisfied with every stage of our relations – they were pretty prompt about sending it, the appearance is excellent, it’s pleasant to the touch, and boulder-strewn meadow grass on one side, semi-desert on the other is perfect for my needs. Although I missed a special promotion deal offering a free strip of printed river, they were kind enough to send me one anyway. I found them courteous and helpful at all stages. My order had to get from the UK to Thailand, by the way.

They have a Facebook page, so you could get more info there, I’m sure, but I certainly recommend them.

[Ian Marsh]

Blackhat wrote:

I know someone who had to try twice before getting the right mat. Mike

So do I. Twice. 🙂

Ian
Fighting 15s
www.fighting15s.com

[Leon Pendraken]

Mr. Average wrote:

If I bought a mat from TWG which I had sent to an address in the UK with intent to use it there, I would pay VAT on it. Having it sent to the USA, I don’t pay VAT…

Just to jump in here, this would only be true if the UK company was registered for VAT.  Any company with a turnover below £85,000 doesn’t have to be VAT-registered, so they wouldn’t have any VAT in their prices to remove.  I know this causes confusion at times for folks outside of the UK and some companies get a bad rap even though they’re not doing anything wrong.  Tiny Wargames doesn’t seem to show a VAT number on their site so I would assume that they’re not VAT registered and wouldn’t be able to remove any sales tax from their prices.

 

deephorse wrote:

At the Stockton show in November (IIRC) 2018 I ordered a mat at their stand.

That might have been Geek Villain instead, as Tiny Wargames have never attended Battleground?

 

 

 

www.pendraken.co.uk - Now home to almost 6000 products, including over 4200 products in 10mm, plus MDF bases, Vallejo paints, I-94 decals, Red Vectors MDF buildings, Raiden Miniatures, Militia Miniatures and much, much more!

[Keith Barker]

I had read lots of reports about very slow delivery, no esponse to emails which seemed to be bad customer service.

So I changed my mind and went with DeepCutStudios instead for yet another two mats and was very happy with the result. You can see two of the mats in use on  my blog.

[Keith Barker]

Leon Pendraken wrote:

Any company with a turnover below £85,000 doesn’t have to be VAT-registered, so they wouldn’t have any VAT in their prices to remove. I know this causes confusion at times for folks outside of the UK and some companies get a bad rap even though they’re not doing anything wrong.

This is going to be a real pain for us “europeans”. We will now have to pay VAT when the parcel enters “europe”. This can be compensated for, by VAT being deducted by the seller. If the seller doesn’t have anything to deduct, then my cost has just increaced by 25% (in addition to any handling charges the local Post Office charges). So this means I will avoid buying from small companies, which is a pity because everyone has to start small.

[Leon Pendraken]

Keith Barker wrote:

This is going to be a real pain for us “europeans”. We will now have to pay VAT when the parcel enters “europe”. This can be compensated for, by VAT being deducted by the seller. If the seller doesn’t have anything to deduct, then my cost has just increaced by 25% (in addition to any handling charges the local Post Office charges). So this means I will avoid buying from small companies, which is a pity because everyone has to start small.

 

You’re right and I’ve chatted with a few of those companies about this.  With the upcoming VAT OSS system in the EU it might be worth some of them registering voluntarily (you can do this if you’re below the threshold) and then they can charge the correct VAT for the destination country and avoid that additional cost to their European customers.  They’ll each have to weigh up the costs/benefits though and see if it’s worth doing for their business.

www.pendraken.co.uk - Now home to almost 6000 products, including over 4200 products in 10mm, plus MDF bases, Vallejo paints, I-94 decals, Red Vectors MDF buildings, Raiden Miniatures, Militia Miniatures and much, much more!

[Mr. Average]

These 20-25% taxes are insane to me. How did this get so out of control? Sales tax in the US averages 6.5%. It’s usually shipping costs that wreck it for us.

[Not Connard Sage]

Mr. Average wrote:

These 20-25% taxes are insane to me. How did this get so out of control? Sales tax in the US averages 6.5%. It’s usually shipping costs that wreck it for us.

 

Politics is frowned upon here, so let’s just say that there’s no such thing as a free lunch.

Obvious contrarian and passive aggressive old prat, who is taken far too seriously by some and not seriously enough by others.

[Mr. Average]

Sorry, yeah, it wasn’t meant as a political remark, just an expression of surprise. But such is life – like I said, we don’t pay the tax here but the shipping costs you. Sooner or later we’ll all get used to what’s “new” in this and find ways around it. And fact of the matter is most of the minis I want are coming from the UK these days so I find a way.

[deephorse]

Leon Pendraken wrote:

 

deephorse wrote:

At the Stockton show in November (IIRC) 2018 I ordered a mat at their stand.

That might have been Geek Villain instead, as Tiny Wargames have never attended Battleground?

Really?  Maybe it was Sheffield then, before it went belly up.  In recent years Sheffield and Stockton were the only shows I went to.  It was definitely Tiny that I bought from.

Play is what makes life bearable - Michael Rosen

[Leon Pendraken]

deephorse wrote:

Really? Maybe it was Sheffield then, before it went belly up. In recent years Sheffield and Stockton were the only shows I went to. It was definitely Tiny that I bought from.

That might be it, they were definitely at Triples in that last year.  If I remember right they had one of the mats out on the floor for you to walk over, to show how durable they are?

www.pendraken.co.uk - Now home to almost 6000 products, including over 4200 products in 10mm, plus MDF bases, Vallejo paints, I-94 decals, Red Vectors MDF buildings, Raiden Miniatures, Militia Miniatures and much, much more!

[Tiny Wargames]

Thanks for the comments and feedback, we are available on here, Twitter, Facebook, email, Instagram. Any queries or questions please ask? Richard from Tinywargames.

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