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  • #198374
    Avatar photoMike
    Keymaster

    Thinking about this topic HERE

    How important is visual buy in with your games?
    How much effort/detail/other is required for you to achieve it?

    For most of my games it is quite important.
    The more established the campaign/setting/time playing it the more buy visual buy in I prefer.
    So my 12mm WFB that has been going a few years now requires more bits to make it real.
    Farmsteads with animals, fern leaves sprouting from the ground, the glow of 3d printed sconces on walls painted, roadside detritus etc.
    All these extra touches go to making the world more real and entice me back to play again.

    For the Slaine project I am starting less so.
    I am happy to play with some rough painted models and crude terrain until I get a feel for if I want to carry on with it long term.
    If that is the case then I will make more detailed models and put more effort into painting the models as with the 10mm WFB.
    But at this stage with no games played against anyone, rough and ready is the name of the game.

    Though, always remains the balance between pretty and playable.

    For you?

    #198375
    Avatar photoTony Hughes
    Participant

    If I knew what ‘visual buy in’ meant I’d possibly answer.

     

    #198376
    Avatar photoMr. Average
    Participant

    I’m also not familiar with the term but by context I imagine you mean the extent to which you work on the ancillary and not distinctly gameplay related bits of the game, like the scenery, the terrain, etc. For me it varies as well, but I do strive for a high level in my game sets. I admit it’s a bit of a slog sometimes though, since I build things for a living (houses to be exact) so it often makes me feel weirdly resentful of doing as a hobby what I do for a living. Hence my recent move towards prefab terrain tiles for my Warmaster project – I could do the terrain myself but it feels like a chore, not a hobby. I do want the nice terrain though, with the little extras. But when I remember a game I often remember the feel of it as though I were in it, and memory glosses over whatever imperfections there were in the setup at the time.

    #198377
    Avatar photoMike
    Keymaster

    I guess I mean how realistic does something need to be for you to invest in it.
    Or how pretty does something need to be for you to want to play it.
    Do you get more from highly detailed well painted set ups than you do from felt on felt?

    Can you escape to the setting with just imagination, or are pretty models needed/helpful?

    A non wargaming example would be, maybe…?
    So many sci-fi films leave me cold as the CGI is so clearly CGI and not a physical thing I get jolted from my suspension of disbelief and am no longer captured by the story, but thrown out of it by the jarring fx.
    I would rather see some old models in films even if a bit ropey looking than some cruddy CGI.
    I don’t need to believe the models exist, they do, they are physical things, but very obvious CGI just makes me think it is not real, and thus care less.

    Does that even help?

    EDIT:

    How important is it that the models speak to you on a visual level, and how do you achieve that required level?

     

    #198378
    Avatar photoMike Headden
    Participant

    On a scale of 1-100?

    About -150

    Good company ranks at 100
    Good rules at 75
    Miniatures accurate enough that everyone can tell what is what also 75
    Terrain that units/ figures can stand on without sliding off/ falling over comes in around 50

    I’m not averse to creating things like my Bronze Age refugees/ merchants and my shepherd and flock of sheep for a bit of period colour but I’ve happily played games with Playmobile figures on terrain made from a child’s wooden building blocks. Don’t worry said child was fast asleep and unaware of his father and I perpetrating such sacrilege! 🙂

    Also, I’d say that if you are watching TV/ a movie and noticing the CGI the problem is more likely the script than the scenery.

    There are 100 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who can work from incomplete data

    #198386
    Avatar photoTony Hughes
    Participant

    Right, got it now.

    I do like the look of a well put together battlefield but never seem to get beyond ‘usable’ for the games I put on at home.

    I do have some quite nicely painted 6mm buildings to go with my 6 & 10mm armies but they get less outings than they deserve and often end up being removed once they are occupied by troops. I don’t do low level skirmish games so even 6mm buildings with 10mm figures are way over ground scale.

    I still plan to work up some terrain blocks using Brigade Models 1/1000th buildings – many of which have been painted for years now – which will help in getting a good look without the disjoint between models and groundscale.

    I’m happy to shell out for something I feel will work for me – and I have cupboards full of stuff to prove it. What I’m not that great at is getting round to finishing what I started. I’m doing fairly well in finishing figures & rules so games can be played but terrain to go with them is definitely lower down my priority list.

     

    #198393
    Avatar photoMike
    Keymaster

    You seem to be a bit sad you are not making the most of your collection?

     

    #198394
    Avatar photowarwell
    Participant

    I don’t worry about it at all. Currently playing Five Klicks from the Zone using meeples.

    #198397
    Avatar photoMartinR
    Participant

    I generally like the games to look good if I’m playing with figures. One of my pals likes to roll up with beautiful figures and then play on a bit of hardboard with terrain indicated with bits of felt, which seems a bit pointless.

    I’ll happily use counters or whatever when I’m trying stuff out, and I tend to go a bit lighter on extra terrain etc if I’m solo playing or have to transport stuff a long way.

     

    "Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

    #198438
    Avatar photoPaint it Pink
    Participant

    For RPGs all I need is my imagination.

    Boardgames are good to go.

    Tabletop miniature games I need it all to be consistent, and by consistent I mean the best it can be given that a wargame is not a diorama.

    Probably a higher bar than some, but not as high as others.

    One is good, more is better
    http://panther6actual.blogspot.co.uk/
    http://ashleyrpollard.blogspot.co.uk/

    #198441
    Avatar photoTony Hughes
    Participant

    “You seem to be a bit sad you are not making the most of your collection?”

    Probably true but I’ve been retired from the ‘real’ job for 15 years now, and 10 of those were spent painting stuff for other people, so I now tend to be more relaxed about when my own stuff gets done. I do have more stuff to paint than a sane 73 year old should have but I can pick and choose as I feel like it and don’t have anyone else to please but myself.

    I like smaller scale stuff, 15mm is big for me, and that tends towards the megalomaniac side of me with huge armies. I do try to resist it but often end up with more figures than I can field on a 5×4 ft table.

    I don’t see the point of getting stressed over what I didn’t get round to doing. I have figures I bought 30+ years ago that I painted last year – I get there, eventually, and that is good enough for me.

     

    #198488
    Avatar photoOotKust
    Participant

    Short n quick answer- 1000% yes !

    I’ve spent the last 40 years, inlcuding on behalf of clubs, setting up games that were to look ‘real and ‘proper’ to the naked eye.
    Sometimes a litte kid would ask about some animal, detail or feature that they recognised, and it was heartfelt and cheering.

    I’ve done the same with my own games, terrain and scenery- not all perfect but an attempt all the same. I took time away in my careers, up and down.

    And then having left active gaming [and to some extent painting as much ] I sidetracked! literally to help an older guy with a very large model train layout that was conceptually skillfully engineered, but socially and scenicly challenged.

    So I spent a decade decorating, healing and adding realism and scenery to the vast layout. Sadly he died in late 2017 and before he did he broke up the layout to spare his family the burden.

    So come 2018 and the last job I had vanished, I took up the paintbrushes and dusted off the storage and materials of modelling for the gaming scene once again.

    I trust I can make a small difference, and am still active with the local club I helped with in 1980s.

    IMG_4498_sm.

    davew

    #198496
    Avatar photoMike Headden
    Participant

    “You seem to be a bit sad you are not making the most of your collection?” Probably true but I’ve been retired from the ‘real’ job for 15 years now, and 10 of those were spent painting stuff for other people, so I now tend to be more relaxed about when my own stuff gets done. I do have more stuff to paint than a sane 73 year old should have but I can pick and choose as I feel like it and don’t have anyone else to please but myself. I like smaller scale stuff, 15mm is big for me, and that tends towards the megalomaniac side of me with huge armies. I do try to resist it but often end up with more figures than I can field on a 5×4 ft table. I don’t see the point of getting stressed over what I didn’t get round to doing. I have figures I bought 30+ years ago that I painted last year – I get there, eventually, and that is good enough for me.

    A man after my own heart – Amen brother, amen!

    There are 100 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who can work from incomplete data

    #198527
    Avatar photoThomaston
    Participant

    This is a weird and thought provoking querstion for me. I started in scale models I appreciate realistic models like those from Plastic Soldier Company. Having said that when I see realistic models I tend to expect very realistic simulation to go with it so for miniature games I prefer cartoony miniatures that allow me to do silly things without thinking too much about it.

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