Home Forums Horse and Musket General Horse and Musket Wheels on gun carriages, limbers etc

Viewing 7 posts - 1 through 7 (of 7 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #82695
    General Slade
    Participant

    I was looking through British Napoleonic Field Artillery by C.E Franklin and I noticed that on the plans the wheels of the gun carriages and limbers appear to ‘lean out’ slightly, in that the space between a pair of wheels is greater at the top of the wheel than at the bottom.  What was the reason for doing this and would it be common for wheels on all horse-drawn vehicles to be positioned like this?

    Basically, should all my wagon wheels lean out slightly at the top?

     

     

    #82696
    Patrice
    Participant

    It’s called “angle de carrossage” in French (camber angle?).

    The reason is that when a wheeled cart is advancing, the wheels tend to incline naturally and do not stay in a vertical axis; on the long run it damages them. Giving them an opposite angle from the beginning (as shown on the drawing you posted) reduces this strain.

    For the same reason the wheel spokes are not on the same vertical axis as the rest of the wheel (I’m not sure if I explain this well…  you can research articles about wheelwrighting for a better explanation in English) that’s called “écuanteur” in French, I think it was invented in the late 15th century.

    http://www.argad-bzh.fr/argad/en.html
    https://www.anargader.net/

    #82697
    General Slade
    Participant

    Many thanks Patrice.  I am about to put some wheels on some gun carriages so hopefully now I will put them on at the correct angle.

    Best wishes

    Stephen

     

    #82698
    Not Connard Sage
    Participant

    All wheels on a single axle had a positive camber (‘lean out’). It was meant to accommodate travel on high crowned roads by ensuring the wheel made full contact with the road surface. It meant the load would be spread across the whole tyre (steel/iron tyres) and not on its edges. Particularly important with unsprung/semi sprung vehicles.

    The angle would vary according to if it was a fixed (non-turning) or free (turning) axle. Boring stuff to do with projection of cones and stuff like toe-in and toe-out.

    You’ll drive yourself mad with the maths, and as it was usually only a few degrees from vertical  you need to ask yourself ‘does it make a difference in 6/10/15/28mm?’.

     

    Phew, can someone lend me some parentheses? 🙂

     

     

    "I go online sometimes, but everyone's spelling is really bad. It's... depressing."

    #82699
    General Slade
    Participant

    Thanks NCS,

    Don’t worry, I’m not planning to go near the maths (I wouldn’t know where to start) but I will attempt to represent it on my gun carriages.  I’m just putting together some 15mm 12 lb cannon and I’ve found if I bend the ends of the axle very slightly I can give the wheels the positive camber you are talking about.

    #82706
    vtsaogames
    Participant

    Huh. Well, from now on I will try to represent this on any new guns I procure.

    This too shall pass

    #82828
    Etranger
    Participant

    All wheels on a single axle had a positive camber (‘lean out’). It was meant to accommodate travel on high crowned roads by ensuring the wheel made full contact with the road surface. It meant the load would be spread across the whole tyre (steel/iron tyres) and not on its edges. Particularly important with unsprung/semi sprung vehicles. The angle would vary according to if it was a fixed (non-turning) or free (turning) axle. Boring stuff to do with projection of cones and stuff like toe-in and toe-out. … 

    It took me a while to realise that it wasn’t simply that the axle on the model had become bent! Visually it does differ quite a bit between different wagons though. A couple of civilian examples below. The former you would notice in 15mm, the latter not so much.

    Definite camber. (from http://www.victorianlondon.org/publications/thomson-26.htm )

     

    Little or no camber.

    • This reply was modified 3 years, 4 months ago by Etranger.
    • This reply was modified 3 years, 4 months ago by Etranger.
Viewing 7 posts - 1 through 7 (of 7 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.