[MartinR]

I’ve run lots of participation games at shows as part of a club, and individually at more focused wargaming events. Ive done the odd demo game too.

It takes lots of design work, a certain amount of prep and it is useful to have team support on the day. We have a fairly tried and tested formula for show games in terms of approach (but a very varied range of subjects).

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

Wargames rules since time immemorial have differentiated between nippy ‘natives’ be they barbarians, fuzzy wuzzies or the tali ban, and lumbering ‘imperialists’ be they legionaries, soldiers of the queen or the Royal Anglicans in Afghanistan.

So yes, our ultra modern rules have Western Armies lumbering around slowly, unless they leave the body armour and batteries behind, which tends to be frowned on. As John notes, it has been observed to be tactically significant.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

Im quite happy to play scenarios with very specific victory conditions (capture two of three objectives by turn x, amass y victory points by doing this that or the other) but for ones I design myself I prefer something a bit more narrative. I usually try and give each side two to four things they can have a go at doing and then people can explain at the end why they have won.

My real joy is finding the original operations orders and giving the players those, although there are a surprising number of “fight to the last man” type orders, which aren’t very helpful.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

!! I seem to recall reading that Napoleon had almost many books written about him as Jesus.

A useful one stop shop is “Napoleon’s Marshals” B David Chandler, but there are scores, nay hundreds of similar tomes (many with identical titles).

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

I tend to base figures at a ratio of 1:2 (so a rifle group has three figures, LMG team two figures etc), which means snipers, 2″ mortar teams etc only get one figure, usually on a round base.

For individual based type games, then I don’t base teams as a unit unless I need to in order to make the models work (typically loader figures for belt fed machineguns).

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

Thanks Phil, I thought that was really interesting.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

In AHGC War and Peace, only two Generals rated a +3, their mere presence being quite sufficient to swing a battle in their favour, Napoleon and Wellington. That is good enough for me.

Wellington of course rated Bonapate highly, him being worth 40,000 men etc, something which Dupuy factored in when doing his QJM model of Waterloo.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

I must confess, that if someone says D20s, I instantly think of a dice numbered 0 to 19 as the number of sides on a dice bears little relation to the numbers (average dice, CnC dice, scatter dice etc). In fact, I think my old polyhedral dice are set up to be used as both D10 and D20. Numbered 0-9 but with a little dot next to half of the digits, so that one of the 1s can be read as 11 etc.

My speed and acid raddled brain may be misremembering of course:)

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

My eyesight has dimmed so I need help seeing stuff clearly (lights, glasses), and I have a bad back so prefer to sit to play rather than bending over large tables. The house is a crammed with almost 50 years of accumulated wargaming stuff, so I have manage space carefully. I am also exhausted by work, so we only play short games at the club.

However, my kids are grown up, and I still find the modelling aspects good for my mental health. Living in the now and bringing some order in a world gone mad. The social aspects are also invaluable, the club attracts people from all walks of life and it helps keep uou out of the echo chamber. I am still energised by simulation and history, and trying to design short, enjoyable and yet passably “realistic” games is a fascinating challenge. Thoughts are also turning to retirement, and I’m hoping to start winding down work a bit in the next year or two.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

tbh, we model doctrinal differences in WW2 by relying on the players, not a ton of rules. So last night we conducted a Soviet battalion attack, with all the subunits deployed in the standard Soviet tactical arrangement – unified sections in lines with multiple echelons, fire & movement conducted by sections controlled by the platoon CO and the reserve echelons committed by the battalion CO with a nice big support firebase.

Jerry was somewhat more flexible with all sorts of fancy interlocked fire arcs, defence in depth, local counterattack forces etc.

 

 

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

I dug out my original ‘percentage dice’from the early. They are 20 sided but marked up as 0-9 twice, so function as D10s. My ratty old White Box D&D set does indeed include a proper ten sided D10 (as well as the awful, unrollable D4. We used to use a D8 and halve it).

 

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

Don Glewwe wrote:

What’s the point?

Because it is interesting?

Relative loss ratios are an indication of relative combat effectiveness, amongst other things, although force ratios and loss ratios in air warfare behave very weird ways (and nothing like Lanchester predicted).

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

I still have my dice from White Box D&D, as well as a pair of “percentile dice” purchased in the mid 1970s. I am pretty sure the latter were D20s marked up 0-9 while the former was a proper ten sided D10. I’ll have to dig them out and check.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

Where did your pal get the AT_ATs from? I’ve been looking for some reasonably priced small scale ones (the Bandai 1/144 ones are £37 each!).

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

Well worth watching.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

Abwehrschlacht wrote:

I’ve only ever seen photos of it, would love to see it in real life!

Glad to have been of help, I started a 20mm ww1 project myself a few years ago, but realised I was replicating my 15mm stuff so I sold it all off. But there’s quite a few posts about it on my blog so you can see what some of the figures look like.

LOL. At some point I’ll bin all the 20mm stuff and replace it all with 15s too, I have far more 15mm WW1 than 20mm, the latter is just late war British, French and German, hence all the tanks.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

Rules, well I’m a big battle kind of guy, so Great War Spearhead or Square Bashing (both use 1 base = 1 company so armies are interchangeable).

For a simpler game, the One HOur Wargames WW1 rules (Machine Age, with the tanks and barrages optional rules) actually work really well. There is a WW1 mini campaign on the Neil Thomas yahoo group (the group is called AMW afterhsi Ancient and Medieval sets) we’ve played through.

I also have tons of 20mm WW1 figures, mainly plastic. Plastic Soldier Review is your friend, but Emhar, Revell, Esci, HaT and even venerable Airfix do great figures. My cavalry are mainly metal (IT Miniatures, Tumbling Dice? I can’t recall). Emhar and HaT do piles of cheap, good quality plastic artillery. You’ll need lots of guns. Irregulars ‘Really Useful Guns’ range is great for cheap heavy artillery (6″ guns, Krupps 150mm, Schneider 155s etc).

You won’t need loads of tanks, but there are plenty out there. Mine are mainly Emhar and Airfix (Mark IVs, Whippets, a lonely A7V etc), my FT-17s are Armourfast. The French are less well catered for but Lancer do a nice St Chamond. My Schneider CA is a card model, which was really horrible to build, but it was a horrible tank:)

Because I’m lazy, my planes either second hand ‘Wings of War’ prepaints, or some old diecast models I bought years ago.

 

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

I still refer to Ian Shaws ancient tome mentioned above. The WW1 data book by Ellis isn’t bad coverage for the whole of WW1.

It would be a monumental task to bring together all the official TO&E for various subunits, even assuming the records still exist and are accurate, let alone whether they were adhered to (e.g. how many Russian tank Destroyer brigades really did have an attached tank regiment?).

Shame the old bayonetstrength site died, Gary made a really good job if it.

The KStN site is interesting, but again, it is patchy and there is considerable divergence in reality.

A more general observation is that in a war involving tens of millions of people where the basic currency was divisions and the small change was battalions, no one at the time was hugely interested in keeping detailed records of what each platoon was armed with, let alone each section.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

I use A4 boxfiles line with steel paper. For 2mm and 6mm figs I build extra trays within them (you can easily get three layers of 2mm figs in a low profile A4 boxfile).

One of my pals swears by Really Useful Boxes, but they seem very expensive compared to the humble boxfile and I hate all the waste space on my limited shelving space. I have some 54mm figs in some RUBs, but they’ve ended up on the floor under my daughters bed!

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

I used to base my 6mm chaps with a three man gun group, but my 15 and 20mm chaps only get two as that fits better on the base.

2″ mortars were issued as a personal weapon, although Irl they may have had some helpers to carry some bombs around. I base them as two figs, but actually slightly regret that. At some point I may go back and base them individually on Pennies (it is only a couple of blokes, same as a sniper team).

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

I primarily play at the Wargames club, so I need to be able to transport all the stuff, get it set up and put it all away as fast as possible. Over the decades we have developed endless tricks to do this, primarily in the way storage boxes are organised and the durability of certain items (eg I have grab bag of virtually indestructible wooden buildings) as well as the use of gridded games and prepared ground sheets with the roads already on them.

Smaller games certainly help, but I can generally get set up in 20 minutes and take down in less than 15 (everyone mucks in) as it is mainly a matter of matching items to the relevant storage boxes. A certain amount of sorting out at home later may be required.

I suspect our little group is particularly efficient, some of our gaming colleagues are still setting up while we are packing away! But they play big 28mm games:)

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

Depends on the terrain and game scale really. The German AT guns dug in on Bourgebous Ridge didn’t have any great difficulty finding lots of targets to engage at 2km range, and 9th RTR War Diary describes a number of occasions in Holland when they were brassing up villages 3km away with HE. Some bits of Holland are quite flat though with very thin intervening tree lines.

I would be a tad surprised to see it in a 1:1 type game though.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

I’ve played a few of these, and they are hard to describe  unless you’ve played one. Imagine a huge commitee game (so lots of players, lots of roles and various supporting props).

It is certainly possible to play them online, as with John Bassetts games on the Cuban Missile Crisis and Berlin Wall Crisis, although in that case it was more a matter of having a sets of team connected by the  miracle of the internet.

It is the player interaction which makes these things work, same as the really big Megablitz games with 20+ players (although they do generally feature toys).

 

 

 

 

 

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

My W&N Peat Brown ink invariably dries glossy. I put matt varnish over it once it has dried (unless it on something shiny, like rifle stocks or a horse).

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

Paul Howarth wrote:

Martin, on a tangent. What are your issues with Rommel please? I had been initially unsure after issues with the Blucher pdf, but would appreciate your thoughts.

Primarily that there are an awful lot of decisions to make, but they principally relate to operating the game mechanics, rather than relating to actual divisional level command decisions. I understand the intent and the outcomes, but if I want to mount a prepared attack on a hasty defence, let’s just call it that rather than faffing around with ops points, a multi phase attack and wrestling with some odd stacking restrictions.

I like the tactics cards (Yes, I immediately dumped the cumbersome ops sheet thing) and some of the relative weapon systems effects are well modelled.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

I often buy new stuff when it comes out, mainly out of interest as I like reading rules. Some get as far as an actual playtest, fewer get as far as a playtest at the club and a tiny minority get played on a regular basis for some months or years. Main example in recent years have been a variety of Neil THomas offerings, which have passed the rigorous selection process, Command and Colours Ancients & Napoleonics, and a(very heavily modified) Memoir 44. Rommel didn’t make it past the initial playtest stage. Some nice ideas, but as a game, oh dear.

The majority languish unloved on my bookshelf, although I might borrow the odd idea or two.

I certainly don’t rush out and buy a load of toys for a new ‘game system’. I’ve got plenty of toys already.

 

 

 

 

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

While the vast majority of tank HE was fired direct at ranges up to 2000 yards (commonly rather less!), bear in mind those odd occasions where Shermans etc were parked on the reverse slope of hills and used to fire 75mm indirect concentrations. WRG let you do that too.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

Yes, these days I blog them, but back in the day I used to write up battle reports, often in a campaign context. It helped bring the whole thing to life.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

There is a difference between dismounting it for cleaning and being able to usefully use it as a weapon. It needs a mount, maybe a stock for an LMG. I think you’d struggle to use a BESA as a ground weapon. The AA Brent would work very well of course.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

As noted, this has come up before, both here and on other forums.

I used to be more precious about these things, but these days I think you can make a game out of anything. Some subjects I wouldn’t run as a public session though, as individual and public tastes vary somewhat and it is a hobby not a job.

Professional Wargamers have game all kinds of distasteful subjects of course.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

I read it a few years ago. I always find memoirs interesting, but it wasn’t one I hung onto (unlike Bellamys “Troop Leader”).

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

The very fact that we hang out on TWW makes us maverick renegades. I’ve generally found Wargamers to be pretty individualistic, but that might just be the ones I associate with more. There are plenty of people at the club who follow the latest fashions (they are all playing Saga and BA at the moment).

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

They are enjoyable romps, but do suffer a bit from having a cast of dozens and the Chosen Men apparently modelling themselves on the cast of Platoon.

A source of memorable and entertaining adventures and quotes which will enliven any Napoleonic game, as well as endless derision.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

Phil Dutré wrote:

Usenet. Those were the days!

rec.games.miniatures.historical anyone?

I still remember one of the first things you saw when you went on usenet was an explanation about netiquette. I don’t even know if people still use that word.

As at least four of the original users of r.g.m.h are on this forum, perhaps it lives on in spirit.

As for thread drift, it is the Internet, people will interact with it as they will. In long threads like this one, most people will barely bother to read all or even any intermediate posts, and by the time they get down here they’ll have largely forgotten the Op anyway.

What amuses me are the people who are surprised, or possibly even infuriated by thread drift. It is really very funny. net cops every one:)

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

There are actual 25mm figures (not to be confused with their 20mm brethren) and then there are the bloated monstrosities which I lump together as ’28mm’ although their actual size is anyone’s guess. These boaters include the likes of Foundry etc.

True 25mm figures tend to be long oop, and merely the preserve of old farts like me.

I did have some 28s for a while but sold the last of them a few years ago.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

I have a few standard scenarios I use as test beds for rules:

Busaco
Agira (Sicily, 1943)
Elst (Sept 1944)
Maltot (July 1944)
Nachod (1866)

Played those loads

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

Not Connard Sage wrote:

Much of which (should) get factored into tabletop movement rates. I’ve never felt the need to add masses of fleeing civilians into my games either

Oh dear, I’m afraid  do have columns of fleeing civilians too.

As Guy notes, this partly depends on the level of game and whether logistics has any role to play at all. I wouldn’t bother with this stuff in a battalion level WW2 game, nor a Corps level WW1 trench assault apart from dumped ammo.

Army level APW though? With all those straggling columns, and poor old Benedecks half starved troops slogging along a singleetrack in Bohemia? There is a reason a Prussian Corps took 50km of road space. And yes, you can just stretch the units out vertically as V&B does, or can shove a load of wagons in the way too.

I appreciate this stuff isn’t for everyone. Sometimes I just use all the logistic elements to decorate the various formation HQs. Railheads make a nice table top feature.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

I have tows (including horse limbers and a variety of horse carts) for twentieth century operational games. There are an awful lot of beans and bullets to haul around on the modern battlefield, and they produce such lovely traffic jams. I aos have piles of fuel trucks, radio vans, repair vehicles, bridges etc.

My nineteenth century stuff has lots of 6mm limbers and wagons (thank you Irregular, also many thanks for the 6mm bearer stands!), although strangely my 15mm Colonial armies don’t have huge amounts of transport apart from mules and camels. A horse cart is a horse cart however, and I’m sure my WW1 and WW2 armies don’t mind lending a few out. My WSS chaps have a rather grand pontoon train.

Even my 54mm chaps have some artillery limbers and wagons, although latter are pilfered from kids cheap plastic Wild West sets.

Real armies are encumbered with tons of baggage which gets in the way and makes their movements somewhat ponderous. It seems a shame not to represent it. I still hate painting horses though, so I have an awful lot of one and two horse carts. Thanks goodness for the internal combustion engine.

 

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

Guy Farrish wrote:

There are rights of passage being abandoned here! I am shocked! How can you be a wargamer if you haven’t nursed your burned and bleeding figures from trying to stick the ends of old Airfix AFV tracks together? Glue didn’t work ,so it was stiching with the nearest grey thread you could find or hot ironwork to melt the ends and hallucinations and crashing headaches for a few hours. Ah the joys! What are a few misaligned (model) limbs compared?! Wimps!

Yeah, it’s a shame so many wargamers have never experienced that.

I have the answer for you for Airfix and all vinyl/soft rubber type tracks – a staple from a stapler. Don’t use the stapler itself. Take a single unbent staple and stick the staple arms into both loose ends of the track – this can be a bit difficult sometimes, depending on the texture on the tracks. Once through, bend the arms of the staple flat. It will work like a set of clamps holding the track together. Sometimes for very wide tracks (think the Fujimi or ESCI/Italeri King Tiger models or the Airfix Tiger), two staples, side by side work well. I’ve used two staples in the past for Airfix Panzer IVs.

The staple can now be pressed so flat that its arms can be hidden by track guides/teeth. I then usually position the track so that the long staple on the outside of the track is along the top run so that it is hidden by the fenders. I’ve also done it on the bottom.

The technique can be used to lengthen a track where it is too short as well, though you are left with a stretch with just a line of staple.

Yes, staples are the way to go, particularly for the Airfix Pz IV where the tracks are too long and have be trimmed down.

As I said in my OP, I like assembling plastic models, and the new ranges of 15mm plastic vehicles are a joy. What I object to is assembling hordes of plastic infantrymen, particularly when the assembled figures still end up in goofy poses with weird mixes of weapons.

Artillery is still a pain, always has been, always will be, particularly if you have to paint a load of horses to pull it.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[MartinR]

Yes, I quite agree. I don’t mind a bit of assembly (like putting a cavalryman on a horse, or maybe putting shields on although I’d prefer not to) and I enjoy sticking plastic tanks together.

Sticking a load of figures together though? No thanks.

Some of the early PSC sets were offenders in this regard, but the newer ones are better. I’ll take goofy poses over having to stick a load of heads and arms together any day.

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[Author]

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