A Change Of Direction

[Punkrabbitt]

I have been playing Five Men In Normandy 1st edition on the Manchukuo front, with my squad of intrepid Japanese soldiers facing off against against Chinese bandits and Soviet invaders. I started to seriously research this particular theater of WWII, and the more I learn, the more horrified I have become by what both the Japanese and Soviets did in Manchuria. It has hit the point where I just can’t game the Japanese as any sort of protagonists. And so I am abandoning my little squad entirely (and just when it was getting good!) and instead focussing sley on my Chinese bandit gang as protagonists; while not all bandits at this time were good people, enough of them were just guys displaced by the war and had no other option to try and feed their families but to pick up weapons and go robbing others of what they needed. It’s been over two months since I’ve played a FMIN solo game because I’ve been working on some other things, but I’ve had plenty of time to think about it! I have refused to play WWII Germans since forever ago for the same reason: they’re just too awful for me to pick their side, even in a game. This will probably have a significant impact on my Bolt Action plans as well; while my Japanese army is almost finished, I may decide to do a full Chinese bandit warband using the Chinese army rules.

But expect some Chinese vs. invaders battle reports. And a last stand of the Japanese vs. the Boof. Because nothing is better than seeing the bad guys get eaten by a giant dog.

Please visit my OSR products for sale at
www.drivethrurpg.com/browse/pub/17194/Punkrabbitt-Publishing

[kyoteblue]

I understand.

[Ivan Sorensen]

I gotcha mate.

I never game WW2 Germans in campaigns and I never write from a German perspective (as much to break the tradition of never-ending PanzerEagleStormOverEuropeFaust titles)
I’ll gladly march out the Prussians for 1815 though.

Others do and that’s fine by me. You do your table and I hope you have a blast. Just not my thing personally.

(and sure, people can ask all manner of hypothetical questions about playing this army while not playing that army and its all toy soldiers and why dont you warglgarbl and hey, you’re probably all right. At your table).

[irishserb]

Understand completely.

I was asked to play bad guys in modern Afghanistan last year, by a vet for his first game.  The game went well, but I felt uncomfortable, and probably would have refused, if the circumstances surrounding  the game had been different.

[Alan Hamilton]

I understand.  I do not play wargame in the operational theatres where I have been engaged.  The little figures quite often have real faces for me.

A good few years ago I was at a wargame show where a game was being played.  Seeing equipment similar to what we were using in my unit on the table I had a chat with the players.  I realised that they were playing a game of an action in which I had been involved.  As I was watching the little tin man that was me was shot and killed.  A rather odd feeling.

[JozisTinMan]

The older I get the more I share that type of sentiment.  One reason, besides just raw interest, that I switched from tactical ww2 to ww1, at least in the Great War everyone in the trenches is a victim of circumstances to some degree or another.

I respect anyone’s feelings in this area, never been in combat, but seen two guys killed in a training accident and that was enough.

A matter of individual choice that I will respect unless it crosses that fuzzy boundary in my head of being in egregiously poor taste.

Like the judge said about pornography. I can’t define it but I know it when I see it.

http://jozistinman.blogspot.com/

[Mike]

but Jesus Christ guys, this is the sort of thing that usually goes on in another site that cannot be named.

People are allowed to talk about things they won’t game, as has been discussed here before, and by yourself.

LINK

LINK

[Ivan Sorensen]

I deleted my response after realizing this was a special sub forum, but Jesus Christ guys, this is the sort of thing that usually goes on in another site that cannot be named. Ivan, aren’t you involved with Disposable Heroes/Coffin For Seven Brothers?

I run Nordic Weasel Games.

Lets look at the WW2 games I have released:

Five Men in Normandy explicitly supports a German campaign alongside the other nationalities.

Five Men at Kursk has four possible campaigns, including a German one with specific reinforcement tables and whatnot.

The Polish war supplement can be played as the Germans too and is weighted towards letting the Germans win.

Both of those are written to be as politically neutral and bereft of sentimentality as needed.
Kursk features several photos of German miniatures to boot.

I gave my explicit permission and support to the publication of Blitzfreeze, a fan supplement for Kursk following a section of German infantry in WW2.

Where Sten Guns Dare only lets you play as the British, because it’s a game about SAS commando ops.
Even playing as Americans is an optional rule.

[Ivan Sorensen]

In addition to the mandatory Germans, I’ve also never played a campaign as the Danes (my own people I might add), Norwegians, Dutch, Belgians, Romanians, Bulgarians, Hungarians, Slovaks, Italians, Chinese, Japanese, Philippines, ANZAC’s, South Africans, Indians, Brazilians, Portuguese, Spanish “blue” divisions or probably a number of other forces I forget, many of which I also have no interest in playing in a campaign game.

I /think/ I’ve run a Finn campaign once, but I might be remembering wrong.

[Ivan Sorensen]

I play Germans in WW2 games.
I don’t want to play Germans in a campaign game.

Why would playing a German campaign be a requirement to play WW2 games?

[Mike]

I’ve said my bit and edited it a few times since you posted this, Ivan. Im just really shocked to hear all this judgement from you based on out conversations in the past.

Ivan Sorensen wrote:

Others do and that’s fine by me. You do your table and I hope you have a blast. Just not my thing personally.

What am I missing?
Ivan seems to be saying he does not like playing X but respects those that do like playing X.
He even writes rules and scenarios to allow people to play X.
Where does he say he is better than anyone who plays the things he won’t?

[Ivan Sorensen]

This is bonkers.

I literally have WW2 German stuff sitting on my table waiting to be painted.

[Ivan Sorensen]

What am I missing?
Ivan seems to be saying he does not like playing X but respects those that do like playing X.
He even writes rules and scenarios to allow people to play X.
Where does he say he is better than anyone who plays the things he won’t?

I don’t even mind playing Germans.

I just don’t like playing them in a campaign game.

[Mike]

Ivan Sorensen wrote:

I don’t even mind playing Germans.

My apologies.

[deephorse]

Ivan Sorensen wrote:

I play Germans in WW2 games. I don’t want to play Germans in a campaign game. Why would playing a German campaign be a requirement to play WW2 games?

 

Did I miss the bit where you explained why this is the case?  Because if you didn’t then I can’t see the logic of that position.

Play is what makes life bearable - Michael Rosen

[Mike]

So to sum up, are you taking issue with their desire not play something they don’t want to?

 

 

[McKinstry]

I served in Southeast Asia and won’t game the era simply as it feels weird to me but I certainly have no issue with others gaming it. I’ve two sons both currently serving including one with a tour in Afghanistan under his belt with another coming and have no desire to game that either but as with SEA, I’ve friends that game modern conflicts and more power to them.

In certain periods I have forces/sides I prefer but among my friends, I play almost any side.

The tree of Life is self pruning.

[Ivan Sorensen]

As I have already explained, I DO play the Germans in WW2 games.

Since you do not seem to actually read what I type, there is no point in continuing this conversation.

[Ivan Sorensen]

Did I miss the bit where you explained why this is the case? Because if you didn’t then I can’t see the logic of that position.

When playing a solo campaign, I like to add a degree of roleplaying and cinematic flair.
I prefer doing that as Allied forces.
For a campaign that follows a specific cast of characters, I prefer them to be fighting for the liberation of Europe.

When it’s a pick up game, the forces are faceless and i’ll play either side.

The irony is I probably spend more time playing my Germans, since the kid wants to play British or Soviets (anything with Valentines) , while my wife wants to play Americans.

[Ivan Sorensen]

Since this discussion is not going anywhere, I am going to close the thread.

If anyone wishes to discuss my gaming table, you are welcome to email me at [email protected]

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