Nobody knows

[Deleted User]

Forums such as TWW are a great source for finding the answers to esoteric questions.

Of course, there are some things that: Nobody Knows.

How about you pose a legitimate wargaming/historical question that you believe no one has a definitive answer for?

To kick off; “What colour were ECW flagpoles?

 

donald

[Shahbahraz]

As opposed to ‘Everybody knows that the dice are loaded’   ?

 

 

 

--An occasional wargames blog: http://aleadodyssey.blogspot.co.uk/ --

[grizzlymc]

What colour were RFC planes.

[Not Connard Sage]

grizzlymc wrote:

What colour were RFC planes.

 

Dope 🙂

Obvious contrarian and passive aggressive old prat, who is taken far too seriously by some and not seriously enough by others.

[grizzlymc]

Don’t call me a dope. Wuz dey gren or bron?

[Not Connard Sage]

😉

Greeny brown. Or browny-green.

Obvious contrarian and passive aggressive old prat, who is taken far too seriously by some and not seriously enough by others.

[Etranger]

Or varnished linen (officially Clear Doped Linen) …

(and for a more serious answer https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/56495-rfcrnas-aircraft-colours/ )

[Not Connard Sage]

Etranger wrote:

Or varnished linen (officially Clear Doped Linen) … (and for a more serious answer https://www.greatwarforum.org/topic/56495-rfcrnas-aircraft-colours/ )

‘Clear doped linen’ was how the undersides were left. The upper surfaces were painted the brown/green colour that everyone disagrees about.

The correct answer, as is often the case with these ‘proper colour’ arguments that gamers love, is “it varied” 🙂

 

Obvious contrarian and passive aggressive old prat, who is taken far too seriously by some and not seriously enough by others.

[deephorse]

What, exactly, did a Montero cap look like?

Play is what makes life bearable - Michael Rosen

[Thaddeus Blanchette]

Nah. The German planes were waaaaaay more dope.

We get slapped around, but we have a good time!

[willz]

Who invented wargaming?

[Bandit]

I like this thread.

Cheers,

The Bandit

[MartinR]

Any question involving the colour of historical artefacts for which we no longer have surviving (unfaded and uncontaminated) real examples or accurate contemporary descriptions which correspond to modern notions of colour is going to be ‘dont’ know’.

We can sometimes hazard a guess. Roman tunics anyone?

 

"Mistakes in the initial deployment cannot be rectified" - Helmuth von Moltke

[Not Connard Sage]

MartinR wrote:

Any question involving the colour of historical artefacts for which we no longer have surviving (unfaded and uncontaminated) real examples or accurate contemporary descriptions which correspond to modern notions of colour is going to be ‘dont’ know’.

You try telling the average gamer that 🙂

We can sometimes hazard a guess. Roman tunics anyone?

What ‘period’? 😉

 

Obvious contrarian and passive aggressive old prat, who is taken far too seriously by some and not seriously enough by others.

[deephorse]

willz wrote:

Who invented wargaming?

The first wargame was invented in Prussia by Johann Christian Ludwig Hellwig in 1780, who sought to develop a chess-like game that more accurately reflected real warfare.  According to Wkipedia!

Play is what makes life bearable - Michael Rosen

[Cerdic]

Did Anglo-Saxons and Vikings use cavalry in combat?

http://28mmreview.blogspot.co.uk

[Patrice]

Not Connard Sage wrote:

What ‘period’?

Precisely between February 30th and February 31st BC.

http://www.argad-bzh.fr/argad/en.html
https://www.anargader.net/

[Thaddeus Blanchette]

What color were French bricoles?

We get slapped around, but we have a good time!

[Guy Farrish]

deephorse wrote:

willz wrote:

Who invented wargaming?

The first wargame was invented in Prussia by Johann Christian Ludwig Hellwig in 1780, who sought to develop a chess-like game that more accurately reflected real warfare. According to Wkipedia!

You know that bit about ‘we don’t know’?

Take a look at ‘Manœuvres, or Practical observations on the art of war.’ by Major William Young.

He suggests a ‘less fashionable game’ than backgammon or chess which might amuse and educate young officers without access to bodies of troops to exercise. He then outlines a way one may lay out his troops on a drawn terrain using ivory or leaden platoons in such situations as he shall think most proper and his antagonist may bring another battalion to attack him with artillery, grenadiers and hussars as they shall agree.

Printed c1770.

So 1780 and Prussia may not be the ‘invention’ of wargaming after all.

 

 

[Mike Headden]

Were the people the Sumerians called the Mellukhans the same as the Indus Valley Civilisation?

If so, did they have troops of any type or were they as peaceful as has been suggested?

If they had troops WTF was their equipment/ appearance/ organisation like?

Answers on a postcard please 😀

 

 

There are 100 types of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who can work from incomplete data

[grizzlymc]

as they shall agree

Scenario rather than points based.

[Bandit]

I got everyone here beat:

Nobody knows what the right way to play toy soldiers is! :-p

Cheers,

The Bandit

[Deleted User]

Mike Headden wrote:

Were the people the Sumerians called the Mellukhans the same as the Indus Valley Civilisation?

Didn’t the Sumerians import sesame seed oil from Meluḫḫa? I thought the Sumerian word for it seemed to be Dravidian? Ipso facto…..not perfect proof but fairly compelling.

As for being peaceful, that comes from some fantasy novel, doesn’t it? Warfare & aggression seems to peak with Bronze Age peoples: they had “stuff” & needed to protect it.

donald

[willz]

Guy Farrish wrote:

deephorse wrote:

willz wrote:

Who invented wargaming?

The first wargame was invented in Prussia by Johann Christian Ludwig Hellwig in 1780, who sought to develop a chess-like game that more accurately reflected real warfare. According to Wkipedia!

You know that bit about ‘we don’t know’? Take a look at ‘Manœuvres, or Practical observations on the art of war.’ by Major William Young. He suggests a ‘less fashionable game’ than backgammon or chess which might amuse and educate young officers without access to bodies of troops to exercise. He then outlines a way one may lay out his troops on a drawn terrain using ivory or leaden platoons in such situations as he shall think most proper and his antagonist may bring another battalion to attack him with artillery, grenadiers and hussars as they shall agree. Printed c1770. So 1780 and Prussia may not be the ‘invention’ of wargaming after all.

 

I found this on tinternet

 

 

[deephorse]

Cave Man times eh?  Can’t get much earlier than that.  Though once he said that I stopped listening.

Play is what makes life bearable - Michael Rosen

[MattH]

What caused the Mary Rose to sink?

https://shellsplash.blogspot.com/

[Not Connard Sage]

MattH wrote:

What caused the Mary Rose to sink?

 

Lack of flotation.

Obvious contrarian and passive aggressive old prat, who is taken far too seriously by some and not seriously enough by others.

[Guy Farrish]

 

Wells? Johnny Come Lately! RL Stevenson 1898 or Spenser Wilkinson.

Or there are military variants of chess much earlier: Konigs Spiel for example by Christoph Weickhmann in 1644 where the board was 13×15 squares with 58 pieces all named and shaped like military characters.

Andrew Wilson in ‘War Gaming’ cites one John Clerk as an author of a set of naval wargames rules c 1700, but I wonder if he were not confusing the authorship and date. Sir John Clerk of Pennicuik 1676-1755 was not as far as I know an authority on naval matters but his son, John Clerk of Eldin was, and is well known as the author of ‘An Essay on Naval Tactics’ 1779 (pub 1790)which revolutionised thinking on naval tactics. In the preface he wrote:

‘As I never was at sea myself, it has been asked, how I should have been able to acquire any knowledge in naval tactics…I had recourse not only to every species of demonstration, by plans and drawings, but also to the use of a number of small models of ships, which, when disposed in proper arrangement, gave most correct representations of hostile fleets, extended each in line of battle…every possible idea of naval system could be discussed without the possibility of any dispute.’

That sounds like the thing (although the bit about no possibility of dispute suggests wargamers had not yet got fallen into their current ways!)

[Don Glewwe]

Not Connard Sage wrote:

MattH wrote:

What caused the Mary Rose to sink?

Lack of flotation.

Wrong – all the flotation rose to the surface as she sank…

[Not Connard Sage]

Guy Farrish wrote:

Andrew Wilson in ‘War Gaming’

Bloody hell, I haven’t heard mention about either the author or the book in years. It was a title that used to get thrown about a lot in the 70 and 80s in arguments about ‘realism’ in wargames .

I bought a used copy from Terry Wise. I have no idea what happened to it.  I don’t even remember reading it…

Obvious contrarian and passive aggressive old prat, who is taken far too seriously by some and not seriously enough by others.

[Guy Farrish]

I think it was my first book about wargaming – can’t say it inspired me to play games – TVs Callan and Charge! did that. It did open my eyes to a lot of interesting weirdness out there that didn’t get thought about in Macclesfield in 1970!

Mine is an original Pelican  copy – bought in 1970, for 30p or 6/-

Its mostly about ‘professional’ military wargames. The bit about the Japanese Imperial Navy run through of Midway is entertaining – beware senior officers who think they know best!

I think John Curry may be flogging a reprint on his History of Wargaming site under its original title ‘The Bomb and the Computer’ .

[Patrice]

What colour was Henry IV white horse?

http://www.argad-bzh.fr/argad/en.html
https://www.anargader.net/

[Deleted User]

Patrice wrote:

What colour was Henry IV white horse?

Trick question: it was a donkey.

donald

 

(correct answer: RED since the favorite wine of the king was – Cheval Blanc)

[Les Hammond]

Depends…

6mm France 1940

http://les1940.blogspot.co.uk/
https://www.facebook.com/groups/386297688467965/

[Ivan Sorensen]

The two questions that usually stump forums are:

“Exactly how were trench shotguns issued in WW1 American forces?”

“Exactly how was the Federov Avtomat issued and employed in WW1 Russian forces?”

We’ve kicked the ball around on at least one of these on here, I believe.

[Author]

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